7 ms·

> Apple said the update violated an App Store rule that doesn’t let developers show “irrelevant” information to users. I'm curious which rule this is and to wh

> Apple said the update violated an App Store rule that doesn’t let developers show “irrelevant” information to users. I'm curious which rule this is and to what or whom the information needs to be irrelevant to to be in breach.

disillusioned 6y ago
3.1.3(b) is probably what they're obliquely referencing, but I was once told by an Apple App Reviewer that "not all of our rules or guidelines are published" which caused me to have an aneurysm and shout "THEN WHAT'S THE POINT OF THE RULES?" "You must not directly or indirectly target iOS users to use a purchasing method other than in-app purchase, and your general communications about other purchasing methods must not discourage use of in-app purchase." 2.3.10 has a bit about not including "irrelevant information about Apple or the development process." It's under the Metadata section, but still: "2.3.10 Make sure your app is focused on the iOS, Mac, Apple TV or Apple Watch experience, and don’t include names, icons, or imagery of other mobile platforms in your app or metadata, unless there is specific, approved interactive functionality. Make sure your app metadata is focused on the app itself and its experience. Don’t include irrelevant information, including but not limited to information about Apple or the development process." https://developer.apple.com/app-store/review/guidelines/ https://developer.apple.com/app-store/review/guidelines/
- tristanj 6y ago
  The app store guidelines are a complete joke. Apple can change the guidelines at any time. They make up 'rules' to their own benefit. And selectively enforce existing ones so major players get a free pass. Developers have no recourse, other than leaving the platform.
  - aembleton 6y ago
    > And selectively enforce existing ones so major players get a free pass. Are Facebook not a major player on iOS?
    - StavrosK 6y ago
      He didn't say all major players.
    - tristanj 6y ago
      Facebook isn't a big enough player to get a free pass. Apple know they can bully Facebook and Facebook will back down (they have done this). Here's a few examples of Apple selectively enforcing their rules. Apple agreed to charge Amazon a 15 percent fee instead of the standard 30 for subscriptions https://www.theverge.com/2020/7/30/21348108/apple-amazon-prime-video-app-store-special-treatment-fee-subscriptions https://www.theverge.com/2020/7/30/21348108/apple-amazon-pri... Apple allows WeChat include Mini Programs. These are 3rd party web pages the user can install that are tightly integrated with WeChat features. They're basically apps that run within WeChat. In my opinion this violates the app store premise BUT WeChat is so crucial to Chinese users Apple can't pull the app. So they bent and rewrote the rules to allow it. http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1137321.shtml http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1137321.shtml But, when Facebook tried this with Facebook Gaming, which does something really similar to WeChat Mini Programs, they got banned by Apple. https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/18/technology/apple-ios-facebook-gaming-app.html https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/18/technology/apple-ios-face... Apple allows Chinese customers to make app store purchases using WeChat Pay or Ali(baba) pay. Meanwhile in the US, it's impossible to pay using the competing Facebook pay / Google pay. https://www.wsj.com/articles/apple-app-stores-chinese-customers-get-new-way-to-pay-for-purchases-1504078004 https://www.wsj.com/articles/apple-app-stores-chinese-custom... There's also the Hey fiasco https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23542937 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23542937 and the Wordpress fiasco https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24238856 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24238856 . Meanwhile, Gmail and Netflix are unaffected.
      - grapefruit22 6y ago
        I'm a bit confused on this point. What obligates Apple to treat all business partners the same?
        tristanj 6y ago
  - xtracto 6y ago
    Apple is a joke. At this point in time people that buy apple are just the ones that dont know better... software is getting worse, hardware is getting worse, price is getting higher and in tip of it they make their toasters more and more restricted. I've been using Macs for 7 years (they gave them at job) but would never buy any apple hardware myself. They just dont have any benefits.
  - stOneskull 6y ago
    who are the people at apple making these decisions?
- ajnin 6y ago
  > "not all of our rules or guidelines are published" Which probably means "we make them up on the spot as needed to serve our interests."
  - colejohnson66 6y ago
    My guess: it’s more user friendly wording than “we reserve the right to change the terms at any time”

disillusioned 6y ago

3.1.3(b) is probably what they're obliquely referencing, but I was once told by an Apple App Reviewer that "not all of our rules or guidelines are published" which caused me to have an aneurysm and shout "THEN WHAT'S THE POINT OF THE RULES?" "You must not directly or indirectly target iOS users to use a purchasing method other than in-app purchase, and your general communications about other purchasing methods must not discourage use of in-app purchase." 2.3.10 has a bit about not including "irrelevant information about Apple or the development process." It's under the Metadata section, but still: "2.3.10 Make sure your app is focused on the iOS, Mac, Apple TV or Apple Watch experience, and don’t include names, icons, or imagery of other mobile platforms in your app or metadata, unless there is specific, approved interactive functionality. Make sure your app metadata is focused on the app itself and its experience. Don’t include irrelevant information, including but not limited to information about Apple or the development process." https://developer.apple.com/app-store/review/guidelines/ https://developer.apple.com/app-store/review/guidelines/

tristanj 6y ago
The app store guidelines are a complete joke. Apple can change the guidelines at any time. They make up 'rules' to their own benefit. And selectively enforce existing ones so major players get a free pass. Developers have no recourse, other than leaving the platform.
- aembleton 6y ago
  > And selectively enforce existing ones so major players get a free pass. Are Facebook not a major player on iOS?
  - StavrosK 6y ago
    He didn't say all major players.
  - tristanj 6y ago
    Facebook isn't a big enough player to get a free pass. Apple know they can bully Facebook and Facebook will back down (they have done this). Here's a few examples of Apple selectively enforcing their rules. Apple agreed to charge Amazon a 15 percent fee instead of the standard 30 for subscriptions https://www.theverge.com/2020/7/30/21348108/apple-amazon-prime-video-app-store-special-treatment-fee-subscriptions https://www.theverge.com/2020/7/30/21348108/apple-amazon-pri... Apple allows WeChat include Mini Programs. These are 3rd party web pages the user can install that are tightly integrated with WeChat features. They're basically apps that run within WeChat. In my opinion this violates the app store premise BUT WeChat is so crucial to Chinese users Apple can't pull the app. So they bent and rewrote the rules to allow it. http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1137321.shtml http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1137321.shtml But, when Facebook tried this with Facebook Gaming, which does something really similar to WeChat Mini Programs, they got banned by Apple. https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/18/technology/apple-ios-facebook-gaming-app.html https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/18/technology/apple-ios-face... Apple allows Chinese customers to make app store purchases using WeChat Pay or Ali(baba) pay. Meanwhile in the US, it's impossible to pay using the competing Facebook pay / Google pay. https://www.wsj.com/articles/apple-app-stores-chinese-customers-get-new-way-to-pay-for-purchases-1504078004 https://www.wsj.com/articles/apple-app-stores-chinese-custom... There's also the Hey fiasco https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23542937 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23542937 and the Wordpress fiasco https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24238856 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24238856 . Meanwhile, Gmail and Netflix are unaffected.
    - grapefruit22 6y ago
      I'm a bit confused on this point. What obligates Apple to treat all business partners the same?
      - tristanj 6y ago
- xtracto 6y ago
  Apple is a joke. At this point in time people that buy apple are just the ones that dont know better... software is getting worse, hardware is getting worse, price is getting higher and in tip of it they make their toasters more and more restricted. I've been using Macs for 7 years (they gave them at job) but would never buy any apple hardware myself. They just dont have any benefits.
- stOneskull 6y ago
  who are the people at apple making these decisions?
ajnin 6y ago
> "not all of our rules or guidelines are published" Which probably means "we make them up on the spot as needed to serve our interests."
- colejohnson66 6y ago
  My guess: it’s more user friendly wording than “we reserve the right to change the terms at any time”