4 ms·

I've done a similar thing at the hardware level using a QMK layer. The main benefit for me is being able to use VIM movement keys in every text input. As I'm u

by dlkmp 6y ago

I've done a similar thing at the hardware level using a QMK layer. The main benefit for me is being able to use VIM movement keys in every text input. As I'm using a dual boot setup, it's also pretty handy to have the mapping directly embedded in the keyboard firmware.

modalkb 6y ago
Care to share please?
Ianvdl 6y ago
Thanks for mentioning QMK [0], it's not something I've heard of before, and it seems like a huge step up from standard keyboard firmware. As far as I can tell only a small number of manufacturers officially support it, but at least one person seems to have made some progress getting a standard cooler master keyboard to run it [1]. [0] https://qmk.fm/ https://qmk.fm/ [1] https://github.com/qmk/qmk_firmware/tree/master/keyboards/bpiphany/unloved_bastard https://github.com/qmk/qmk_firmware/tree/master/keyboards/bp...
- secure 6y ago
  It’s reasonably simple to port QMK (at least partially) to a new microcontroller. I have worked on Teensy 3.6 support for QMK, and plan to work on Teensy 4.x support as well.
  - Ianvdl 6y ago
    Is any special hardware needed, or is it all software work?
    - rfoo 6y ago
      It's more like full-hardware-no-software work. Basically if you want to use this on your "standard" keyboards bought off the shelf, you have to either: 1. Open your keyboard, replace the keyboard controller with something that you can program via soldering etc. or 2. Pray your keyboard doesn't use a mask ROM to store its firmware, and it has a powerful enough MCU as keyboard controller, then figure out how to reflash it and port QMK to it blindly.
  - Coolsies 6y ago
    I'm sorry to barge in,but I am in dire need of what you are working on. Could you share your progress or material, Sir?
- least 6y ago
  Hasu usb-usb converter will let you use nearly any keyboard with qmk. https://www.1upkeyboards.com/shop/controllers/usb-to-usb-converter/ https://www.1upkeyboards.com/shop/controllers/usb-to-usb-con... https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=69169.0 https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=69169.0
  - Ianvdl 6y ago
    That's quite helpful, thank you. The Arduino option also seems to be a useful alternative.
- samatman 6y ago
  Drop (née Massdrop) makes a number of fairly 'normal' QMK keyboards. From smallest to largest, the Alt, Ctrl, and Shift. Then there's Ergodox EZ, a company which makes the eponymous ortholinear split key (my daily driver), as well as a 40% keyboard called the Planck, and a new next-gen ergo keyboard called the Moonlander. These are designed from the get go to use layers, where each layer assigns its own meaning to keys, and that's where QMK gets really powerful. There's a whole ecosystem of kits and group buys if you're looking to make a hobby out of it, but if you just want a keyboard you can program, these have you covered.
  - dlkmp 6y ago
    For people based in Europe who might be interested in an Ergodox or similar, I can recommend a visit to falba.tech. I've ordered two Redox from them by now (for work & home) and am very satisfied with the product so far.
SuperPaintMan 6y ago
Was thinking that the whole time I was reading this! I actually have my layout optimized for i3/Vim-controls and it's the default for GergoPlex. I used to use xmodmap hacks but I got sick of maintaining changes across/OS's, having it on the keyboard makes it so much easier. Only downside is carrying around a QMK keyboard! Layout: https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-rRS_TOYuIQQ/XhRERox3moI/AAAAAAABEB0/uTThutO8H9o8HK-sdNgzOKC1-gIdyEFoACLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/Capture.png https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-rRS_TOYuIQQ/XhRERox3moI/AAAAAAABE... GergoPlex: https://www.gboards.ca/product/gergoplex https://www.gboards.ca/product/gergoplex
- Legogris 6y ago
  Just curious, how much time would you say it took you to 1) build and make it, 2) get used to the layout?
  - SuperPaintMan 6y ago
    >build and make it Depends on how you define 'build' here, I'm assuming you mean come to what would become the final design for GergoPlex. That took about a year and a half, my first two designs (Gergo and Georgi respectively) sought to improve on my issues with the ErgoDox (mostly size, PCB-forehead, height, thumb-cluster). After a year of using Gergo and diving into QMK and a failed attempt at picking up stenography, I came up with the idea for a more chord-orientated layout. It didn't take long to get working hardware (as it was a reduction of an existing design), but the layout took about two weeks before everything had settled into it's final place. I did a bit of a write-up over on the blog of how I ended up dailying GergoPlex from a full size 104 [1] and the slow descent into preprocessor madness [2] to make the Combo decorators work. The weird part was tuning QMK so combos like 'we' wouldn't misfire while typing and analyzing my Vim usage to find comfortable places for frequently used chords. (Such as JK for :, WE or UI for Esc, NM for Enter, XC for -, M< for _, etc) >get used to the layout At every transitional step I'd say maybe a week? The harder part was finding a keymap that worked for me. But I started with a Sun-Style layout on the ErgoDox and slowly adpated it as I moved to smaller boards. Control is on 'A' (and ';') on GergoPlex for that reason, and the symbols layers are fairly similar. Honestly, just using it in a active chat server for a few hours was enough to get me 90% of the way there. Every users needs are going to be different, and their layout should match that (it's _why_ you get a programmable keyboard after all!). How you get there is a fiddly endeavour involving lots of flashing and tweaking, but you end up with something ergonomic and deeply personal! [1] https://blog.gboards.ca/2020/01/weird-keyboards-programmable-keyboards.html https://blog.gboards.ca/2020/01/weird-keyboards-programmable... [2] https://blog.gboards.ca/2020/02/adventures-in-obscure-c-features-2020.html https://blog.gboards.ca/2020/02/adventures-in-obscure-c-feat...
cassepipe 6y ago
Would you write about it? I am really curious.
Legogris 6y ago
What I did here was starting to use a premade programmable 60% keyboard (Vortexgear Pok3r) and remapping "Caps-Lock" as modifier to make hjkl into the actual arrow keys. No software config needed.
simias 6y ago
I did the same thing on my Ergodox with QMK, only with emacs/readline bindings. control-M for enter, control-A for beginning of line, control-E for end of line, control-N for next line, control-H for backspace etc... It makes using those clunky web edit boxes (such as the one I'm typing this into right now) somewhat bearable. Getting a fancy ergonomic programmable keyboards is one of the best decisions I've made over the past few years. It's so much more comfortable in the long run. I'm also a big fan of "space cadet shift", which makes left and right shift input ( and ) when pressed on their own. I also have a dual-function caps lock: when pressed on its own it's Escape, when chorded with an other key it's control. You can do that in software with xcape for those who want to give it a try: xcape -t 500 -e 'Shift_L=parenleft;Shift_R=parenright;Control_L=Escape' You'll have to swap left control and caps lock using xmodmap or setxkbmap as well. And for those who are curious to see what a QMK config looks like, it's fairly straightforward (this one is a WIP, there are a few problems with it, but it gives you an idea): https://github.com/simias/qmk_firmware/blob/372b71ca90df01b51c151d34a1e7266444a12497/keyboards/moonlander/keymaps/simias/keymap.c https://github.com/simias/qmk_firmware/blob/372b71ca90df01b5... That's of course assuming that your board is already supported, adding support for a new board is a bit trickier and requires some embedded C know-how.
- ohazi 6y ago
  What are your thoughts on the vertical stagger on ergonomics, vs. just having the left and right side split? Does it actually help, or is it more of an aesthetic choice? I notice carpal tunnel pain in my wrists when I tension or release the tendons in my wrist that curl my fingers to move them up and down. Moving them from side to side doesn't hurt at all, so I'm skeptical that there's anything ergonomically wrong with the normal staggered layout. Split still seems like a good idea, though. How infuriating are regular keyboards after getting used to Ergodox?

by dlkmp 6y ago

modalkb 6y ago

Care to share please?

Ianvdl 6y ago

Thanks for mentioning QMK [0], it's not something I've heard of before, and it seems like a huge step up from standard keyboard firmware. As far as I can tell only a small number of manufacturers officially support it, but at least one person seems to have made some progress getting a standard cooler master keyboard to run it [1]. [0] https://qmk.fm/ https://qmk.fm/ [1] https://github.com/qmk/qmk_firmware/tree/master/keyboards/bpiphany/unloved_bastard https://github.com/qmk/qmk_firmware/tree/master/keyboards/bp...

secure 6y ago
It’s reasonably simple to port QMK (at least partially) to a new microcontroller. I have worked on Teensy 3.6 support for QMK, and plan to work on Teensy 4.x support as well.
- Ianvdl 6y ago
  Is any special hardware needed, or is it all software work?
  - rfoo 6y ago
    It's more like full-hardware-no-software work. Basically if you want to use this on your "standard" keyboards bought off the shelf, you have to either: 1. Open your keyboard, replace the keyboard controller with something that you can program via soldering etc. or 2. Pray your keyboard doesn't use a mask ROM to store its firmware, and it has a powerful enough MCU as keyboard controller, then figure out how to reflash it and port QMK to it blindly.
- Coolsies 6y ago
  I'm sorry to barge in,but I am in dire need of what you are working on. Could you share your progress or material, Sir?
least 6y ago
Hasu usb-usb converter will let you use nearly any keyboard with qmk. https://www.1upkeyboards.com/shop/controllers/usb-to-usb-converter/ https://www.1upkeyboards.com/shop/controllers/usb-to-usb-con... https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=69169.0 https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=69169.0
- Ianvdl 6y ago
  That's quite helpful, thank you. The Arduino option also seems to be a useful alternative.
samatman 6y ago
Drop (née Massdrop) makes a number of fairly 'normal' QMK keyboards. From smallest to largest, the Alt, Ctrl, and Shift. Then there's Ergodox EZ, a company which makes the eponymous ortholinear split key (my daily driver), as well as a 40% keyboard called the Planck, and a new next-gen ergo keyboard called the Moonlander. These are designed from the get go to use layers, where each layer assigns its own meaning to keys, and that's where QMK gets really powerful. There's a whole ecosystem of kits and group buys if you're looking to make a hobby out of it, but if you just want a keyboard you can program, these have you covered.
- dlkmp 6y ago
  For people based in Europe who might be interested in an Ergodox or similar, I can recommend a visit to falba.tech. I've ordered two Redox from them by now (for work & home) and am very satisfied with the product so far.

SuperPaintMan 6y ago

Was thinking that the whole time I was reading this! I actually have my layout optimized for i3/Vim-controls and it's the default for GergoPlex. I used to use xmodmap hacks but I got sick of maintaining changes across/OS's, having it on the keyboard makes it so much easier. Only downside is carrying around a QMK keyboard! Layout: https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-rRS_TOYuIQQ/XhRERox3moI/AAAAAAABEB0/uTThutO8H9o8HK-sdNgzOKC1-gIdyEFoACLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/Capture.png https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-rRS_TOYuIQQ/XhRERox3moI/AAAAAAABE... GergoPlex: https://www.gboards.ca/product/gergoplex https://www.gboards.ca/product/gergoplex

Legogris 6y ago
Just curious, how much time would you say it took you to 1) build and make it, 2) get used to the layout?
- SuperPaintMan 6y ago
  >build and make it Depends on how you define 'build' here, I'm assuming you mean come to what would become the final design for GergoPlex. That took about a year and a half, my first two designs (Gergo and Georgi respectively) sought to improve on my issues with the ErgoDox (mostly size, PCB-forehead, height, thumb-cluster). After a year of using Gergo and diving into QMK and a failed attempt at picking up stenography, I came up with the idea for a more chord-orientated layout. It didn't take long to get working hardware (as it was a reduction of an existing design), but the layout took about two weeks before everything had settled into it's final place. I did a bit of a write-up over on the blog of how I ended up dailying GergoPlex from a full size 104 [1] and the slow descent into preprocessor madness [2] to make the Combo decorators work. The weird part was tuning QMK so combos like 'we' wouldn't misfire while typing and analyzing my Vim usage to find comfortable places for frequently used chords. (Such as JK for :, WE or UI for Esc, NM for Enter, XC for -, M< for _, etc) >get used to the layout At every transitional step I'd say maybe a week? The harder part was finding a keymap that worked for me. But I started with a Sun-Style layout on the ErgoDox and slowly adpated it as I moved to smaller boards. Control is on 'A' (and ';') on GergoPlex for that reason, and the symbols layers are fairly similar. Honestly, just using it in a active chat server for a few hours was enough to get me 90% of the way there. Every users needs are going to be different, and their layout should match that (it's _why_ you get a programmable keyboard after all!). How you get there is a fiddly endeavour involving lots of flashing and tweaking, but you end up with something ergonomic and deeply personal! [1] https://blog.gboards.ca/2020/01/weird-keyboards-programmable-keyboards.html https://blog.gboards.ca/2020/01/weird-keyboards-programmable... [2] https://blog.gboards.ca/2020/02/adventures-in-obscure-c-features-2020.html https://blog.gboards.ca/2020/02/adventures-in-obscure-c-feat...

cassepipe 6y ago

Would you write about it? I am really curious.

Legogris 6y ago

What I did here was starting to use a premade programmable 60% keyboard (Vortexgear Pok3r) and remapping "Caps-Lock" as modifier to make hjkl into the actual arrow keys. No software config needed.

simias 6y ago

I did the same thing on my Ergodox with QMK, only with emacs/readline bindings. control-M for enter, control-A for beginning of line, control-E for end of line, control-N for next line, control-H for backspace etc... It makes using those clunky web edit boxes (such as the one I'm typing this into right now) somewhat bearable. Getting a fancy ergonomic programmable keyboards is one of the best decisions I've made over the past few years. It's so much more comfortable in the long run. I'm also a big fan of "space cadet shift", which makes left and right shift input ( and ) when pressed on their own. I also have a dual-function caps lock: when pressed on its own it's Escape, when chorded with an other key it's control. You can do that in software with xcape for those who want to give it a try: xcape -t 500 -e 'Shift_L=parenleft;Shift_R=parenright;Control_L=Escape' You'll have to swap left control and caps lock using xmodmap or setxkbmap as well. And for those who are curious to see what a QMK config looks like, it's fairly straightforward (this one is a WIP, there are a few problems with it, but it gives you an idea): https://github.com/simias/qmk_firmware/blob/372b71ca90df01b51c151d34a1e7266444a12497/keyboards/moonlander/keymaps/simias/keymap.c https://github.com/simias/qmk_firmware/blob/372b71ca90df01b5... That's of course assuming that your board is already supported, adding support for a new board is a bit trickier and requires some embedded C know-how.

ohazi 6y ago
What are your thoughts on the vertical stagger on ergonomics, vs. just having the left and right side split? Does it actually help, or is it more of an aesthetic choice? I notice carpal tunnel pain in my wrists when I tension or release the tendons in my wrist that curl my fingers to move them up and down. Moving them from side to side doesn't hurt at all, so I'm skeptical that there's anything ergonomically wrong with the normal staggered layout. Split still seems like a good idea, though. How infuriating are regular keyboards after getting used to Ergodox?