3 ms·

Microsoft used its dominant power in one arena to take control of another. Apple doesn’t have a dominant position in smartphone land, and their fees are inline

by olliej 6y ago

Microsoft used its dominant power in one arena to take control of another. Apple doesn’t have a dominant position in smartphone land, and their fees are inline with other hardware and software marketplaces.

chrisco255 6y ago
Of course it does. It has an extremely secure duopoly with Google and it's even stronger when you look at US market in isolation. You don't have to own 100% of a market to be broken up or regulated for anticompetitive practices.
- olliej 6y ago
  I just want to verify that you also consider Sony, Nintendo, and MS to be monopolies as well?
  - romanoderoma 6y ago
    Nintendo was born in 1889 and starting from 1960 it sells game consoles In those 60 years have sold 750 million consoles (mostly Gameboys) Apple sold 2.2 billion devices in 13 years (only counting mobile devices) and have become the company with the largest capitalization in human history I think their power is not comparable, they don't even play in the same league
romanoderoma 6y ago
I see two arguments usually pop up when talking about Apple being a monopolyst 1 - you can buy androids 2 - MS had a dominant position, Apple does not But 1 - Android is not a replacement for Apple and it doesn't come for free (extracting data from an Apple device is harder for the user than it is for a malicious actor, all the money spent on the Apple platform go out of the window) 2 -if Apple has no power, how is it possible that it killed Flash and stopped the adoption of PWAs? If Apple is different from MS why the only browser available on iOS is Safari which is also the main vector for vulnerabilities on Apple mobile devices? (according to security analysts) So Apple has a de facto monopoly, one that is costly to escape from and it's using it to push its own browser volunterly crippling a web standard (PWAs) that would make apps and their store less relevant. If that's a crime or violates antitrust laws I don't know, but that it is true I'm sure.
- mcphage 6y ago
  > if Apple has no power, how is it possible that it killed Flash and stopped the adoption of PWAs? That's a really great question—it shouldn't be possible. It makes me wonder if one of your premises isn't true.
  - romanoderoma 6y ago
    I wish they aren't true. Ironically in the open letter "Thoughts on Flash" Steve Jobs said he would not allow Flash on Apple devices because - to to avoid a third party layer of software coming between the platform and the developer. Exactly what Apple is doing right now. - by almost any definition, Flash is a closed system. Exactly like Apple store. There must be a reason why the open letter is not available anymore on Apple webiste. "he who controls the past controls the future" The main reason to kill Flash was that HTML 5 allowed playing videos and interactive content without the need for a third party plugin. Steve Jobs claimed that (and was right) pure HTML 5 could replace Flash in almost every aspect. Fast forward to WWDC 2020 > Apple has announced that the following Web APIs will not be supported by Safari. Web Bluetooth Web MIDI API Magnetometer API Web NFC API Device Memory API Network Information API Battery Status API Web Bluetooth Scanning Ambient Light Sensor HDCP Policy Check extension for EME Proximity Sensor WebHID Serial API Web USB Geolocation Sensor (background geolocation) User Idle Detection Isn't it even more ironic? They also ruled that after 7 days of non use cookies and the content stored in Indexed DB, LocalStorage, Media keys, SessionStorage and Service Worker registrations will be deleted. Ok, they said this last won't affect apps saved on home screen, but given Apple history do you really trust them?
    - mcphage 6y ago
      And what would you consider the reason for its failure on Android?
      - romanoderoma 6y ago
        Would you invest in a technology that only covers half of the mobile market, knowing that you still have to make two versions of the same app? Besides,PWAs in android haven't failed According to Gartner they cover 50% of the Android market Among the most popular PWAs there are Facebook Forbes Pinterest AliExpress Flipkart Telegram Google Maps Go Uber Trivago Tinder Android market has a much larger variety of devices and PWAs are especially good for low power devices They might not be the sexiest around, but they make a good portion of the World mobile market

by olliej 6y ago

chrisco255 6y ago

Of course it does. It has an extremely secure duopoly with Google and it's even stronger when you look at US market in isolation. You don't have to own 100% of a market to be broken up or regulated for anticompetitive practices.

olliej 6y ago
I just want to verify that you also consider Sony, Nintendo, and MS to be monopolies as well?
- romanoderoma 6y ago
  Nintendo was born in 1889 and starting from 1960 it sells game consoles In those 60 years have sold 750 million consoles (mostly Gameboys) Apple sold 2.2 billion devices in 13 years (only counting mobile devices) and have become the company with the largest capitalization in human history I think their power is not comparable, they don't even play in the same league

romanoderoma 6y ago

I see two arguments usually pop up when talking about Apple being a monopolyst 1 - you can buy androids 2 - MS had a dominant position, Apple does not But 1 - Android is not a replacement for Apple and it doesn't come for free (extracting data from an Apple device is harder for the user than it is for a malicious actor, all the money spent on the Apple platform go out of the window) 2 -if Apple has no power, how is it possible that it killed Flash and stopped the adoption of PWAs? If Apple is different from MS why the only browser available on iOS is Safari which is also the main vector for vulnerabilities on Apple mobile devices? (according to security analysts) So Apple has a de facto monopoly, one that is costly to escape from and it's using it to push its own browser volunterly crippling a web standard (PWAs) that would make apps and their store less relevant. If that's a crime or violates antitrust laws I don't know, but that it is true I'm sure.

mcphage 6y ago
> if Apple has no power, how is it possible that it killed Flash and stopped the adoption of PWAs? That's a really great question—it shouldn't be possible. It makes me wonder if one of your premises isn't true.
- romanoderoma 6y ago
  I wish they aren't true. Ironically in the open letter "Thoughts on Flash" Steve Jobs said he would not allow Flash on Apple devices because - to to avoid a third party layer of software coming between the platform and the developer. Exactly what Apple is doing right now. - by almost any definition, Flash is a closed system. Exactly like Apple store. There must be a reason why the open letter is not available anymore on Apple webiste. "he who controls the past controls the future" The main reason to kill Flash was that HTML 5 allowed playing videos and interactive content without the need for a third party plugin. Steve Jobs claimed that (and was right) pure HTML 5 could replace Flash in almost every aspect. Fast forward to WWDC 2020 > Apple has announced that the following Web APIs will not be supported by Safari. Web Bluetooth Web MIDI API Magnetometer API Web NFC API Device Memory API Network Information API Battery Status API Web Bluetooth Scanning Ambient Light Sensor HDCP Policy Check extension for EME Proximity Sensor WebHID Serial API Web USB Geolocation Sensor (background geolocation) User Idle Detection Isn't it even more ironic? They also ruled that after 7 days of non use cookies and the content stored in Indexed DB, LocalStorage, Media keys, SessionStorage and Service Worker registrations will be deleted. Ok, they said this last won't affect apps saved on home screen, but given Apple history do you really trust them?
  - mcphage 6y ago
    And what would you consider the reason for its failure on Android?
    - romanoderoma 6y ago
      Would you invest in a technology that only covers half of the mobile market, knowing that you still have to make two versions of the same app? Besides,PWAs in android haven't failed According to Gartner they cover 50% of the Android market Among the most popular PWAs there are Facebook Forbes Pinterest AliExpress Flipkart Telegram Google Maps Go Uber Trivago Tinder Android market has a much larger variety of devices and PWAs are especially good for low power devices They might not be the sexiest around, but they make a good portion of the World mobile market