3 ms·

I'm not sure this is true on a grand scale. It's been widely recognized that the majority of piracy is committed by people who would not spend the money on the

I'm not sure this is true on a grand scale. It's been widely recognized that the majority of piracy is committed by people who would not spend the money on the item anyway, or in cases where it is actually difficult to buy the item. There's a reason cheap & easy access to media (streaming) has reduced piracy. People are willing to pay for something if it has value, is offered at a reasonable price and is easy to purchase and own.

tzs 6y ago
> It's been widely recognized that the majority of piracy is committed by people who would not spend the money on the item anyway What about other items? E.g., someone who pirates a graphics editing program that costs several hundred dollars indeed might not have purchased it if piracy had not been available, so arguably that piracy did not cost that software maker a sale. But if piracy had not been an option, would they have just given up on doing their graphics editing? Or would they have looked around for something else instead? Maybe they would have bought Pixelmator Pro, for example, which is under $30, and can do a lot of things that people pirate the more expensive programs for.
- violetgarden 6y ago
  Good points! You start looking for a competitor. Personally, I don’t like the argument “they weren’t going to buy it anyways.” So you get to enjoy the software or movie, and it’s no harm done because you weren’t going to buy it anyways? I think a lot of times this is a cop out excuse. In my mind, and just as your graphics example points out somebody somewhere lost an opportunity or a sale. Not saying there aren’t cases where pirating is justified, but I often get the feeling a lot of people are holding on to excuses that don’t apply specifically to justify their 6 TB Plex library.
- breakfastduck 6y ago
  These a good points, and I must admit I hadn't considered the 'looking for alternatives' idea. Anecdotally though, I think over the long term piracy can be balanced out. I pirated a load of games and software when I was younger with no disposable income which I have now purchased - I could argue the point I'd never have gotten into some hobbies if I hadn't had the piracy option, and they never would have got the purchase later down the line. Totally get where you're coming from though, I don't think it's as black and white as maybe I had previously thought.
DiogenesKynikos 6y ago
Industry groups like RIAA obviously massively overstate their case when they claim every pirated mp3 is a lost sale, but Napster et al. did cost the music industry dearly. If you look at a graph of music sales over time, you can see that the 1990s were a great time for the music business.[1] CDs brought in increasing revenue until the early 2000s, when they precipitously declined. Legal downloads did not make up for the decline in CD sales. Streaming eventually halted the decline, but revenue only stabilized around 2010-2015. In other words, the music industry had a really tough decade. Of course, the music industry also has itself to blame. CDs were expensive, and who wants to pay $20 for an album that only has one song worth listening to? The industry only embraced downloads and streaming once they had no other choice. There's a good documentary on this: System Shock.[2] 1. https://blogs.sas.com/content/graphicallyspeaking/files/2019/11/recorded_music_revenue_simplified3.png https://blogs.sas.com/content/graphicallyspeaking/files/2019... 2. https://vimeo.com/336427561 https://vimeo.com/336427561
- saagarjha 6y ago
  Was that not because people weren’t using CDs anymore and people didn’t want to rent music from a bunch of different places?
  - DiogenesKynikos 6y ago
    CD revenue declined dramatically, and nothing really made up for the decline until the 2010s, when streaming came along. Total revenue from music sales (including legal downloads and streaming) bottomed out at about half of what it had been before Napster. The reason for the decline is pretty clear: music was free and convenient to get online, and CDs were expensive.
- breakfastduck 6y ago
  The music industry had a tough decade in this instance because they missed the digital boat and had to play catch up. If they'd not been so greedy and got involved in mp3 downloads and streaming earlier they might not have had such a hard time. Like your final point, it could easily be argued that piracy has actually forced industries to pursue more consumer friendly practices that they would otherwise have ignored. I'll check out that documentary, it sounds interesting

tzs 6y ago

> It's been widely recognized that the majority of piracy is committed by people who would not spend the money on the item anyway What about other items? E.g., someone who pirates a graphics editing program that costs several hundred dollars indeed might not have purchased it if piracy had not been available, so arguably that piracy did not cost that software maker a sale. But if piracy had not been an option, would they have just given up on doing their graphics editing? Or would they have looked around for something else instead? Maybe they would have bought Pixelmator Pro, for example, which is under $30, and can do a lot of things that people pirate the more expensive programs for.

violetgarden 6y ago
Good points! You start looking for a competitor. Personally, I don’t like the argument “they weren’t going to buy it anyways.” So you get to enjoy the software or movie, and it’s no harm done because you weren’t going to buy it anyways? I think a lot of times this is a cop out excuse. In my mind, and just as your graphics example points out somebody somewhere lost an opportunity or a sale. Not saying there aren’t cases where pirating is justified, but I often get the feeling a lot of people are holding on to excuses that don’t apply specifically to justify their 6 TB Plex library.
breakfastduck 6y ago
These a good points, and I must admit I hadn't considered the 'looking for alternatives' idea. Anecdotally though, I think over the long term piracy can be balanced out. I pirated a load of games and software when I was younger with no disposable income which I have now purchased - I could argue the point I'd never have gotten into some hobbies if I hadn't had the piracy option, and they never would have got the purchase later down the line. Totally get where you're coming from though, I don't think it's as black and white as maybe I had previously thought.

DiogenesKynikos 6y ago

Industry groups like RIAA obviously massively overstate their case when they claim every pirated mp3 is a lost sale, but Napster et al. did cost the music industry dearly. If you look at a graph of music sales over time, you can see that the 1990s were a great time for the music business.[1] CDs brought in increasing revenue until the early 2000s, when they precipitously declined. Legal downloads did not make up for the decline in CD sales. Streaming eventually halted the decline, but revenue only stabilized around 2010-2015. In other words, the music industry had a really tough decade. Of course, the music industry also has itself to blame. CDs were expensive, and who wants to pay $20 for an album that only has one song worth listening to? The industry only embraced downloads and streaming once they had no other choice. There's a good documentary on this: System Shock.[2] 1. https://blogs.sas.com/content/graphicallyspeaking/files/2019/11/recorded_music_revenue_simplified3.png https://blogs.sas.com/content/graphicallyspeaking/files/2019... 2. https://vimeo.com/336427561 https://vimeo.com/336427561

saagarjha 6y ago
Was that not because people weren’t using CDs anymore and people didn’t want to rent music from a bunch of different places?
- DiogenesKynikos 6y ago
  CD revenue declined dramatically, and nothing really made up for the decline until the 2010s, when streaming came along. Total revenue from music sales (including legal downloads and streaming) bottomed out at about half of what it had been before Napster. The reason for the decline is pretty clear: music was free and convenient to get online, and CDs were expensive.
breakfastduck 6y ago
The music industry had a tough decade in this instance because they missed the digital boat and had to play catch up. If they'd not been so greedy and got involved in mp3 downloads and streaming earlier they might not have had such a hard time. Like your final point, it could easily be argued that piracy has actually forced industries to pursue more consumer friendly practices that they would otherwise have ignored. I'll check out that documentary, it sounds interesting