6 ms·

I've been thinking about this a lot, and really believe America was founded on "breaking the rules" and has had really great successes, but really awful consequ

I've been thinking about this a lot, and really believe America was founded on "breaking the rules" and has had really great successes, but really awful consequences. Specific to the pandemic, no one wants to wear a mask. We've been conditioned to believe that breaking the rules (ie disruption) is a good way to move forward. Outside the pandemic, we see oil companies and other manufactures move their operations overseas to countries without power or understanding that the earth is being pillaged, or that the big company is there because they don't have modern labor laws or laws that protect their environment. Hell, the amount of beer cans on the side of the road in my suburban neighborhood and surrounding parks areas indicates that there's a portion of the population that can't handle not drinking and driving. I wonder if this is specific to America/capitalism, but I don't really have a frame of reference for other cultures that champion values like community over the individual, following the rules, etc.

Dirlewanger 6y ago
Interesting take. I've always held that Americans only care about those that they can see from the edge of their property line (neighbors and whatnot). Everyone else? Fuck em. Distrust of all forms of government is practically bred into us, and it shows at all levels. Corporations have pretty much filled that power vacuum.
- ryandrake 6y ago
  Plus, we Americans embrace or at least excuse this corporate power. Elected government tries to control what we can say online? Censorship! Overreach! Unaccountable Facebook and Twitter try to control what we say online? Yes, please! No problem! If you don't like it, leave! It's not censorship because corporate power is doing it rather than government power!
  - cooljacob204 6y ago
    While I somewhat agree with the sentiment, there is a big difference between our government which has the power to take away our rights and a corporation censoring us.
    - bluntfang 6y ago
      Is there a big difference though? Especially considering we got Zucked into believing that TikTok needs to be banned/sold to an American company?
  - toiletfuneral 6y ago
    Just because people don’t want to hear your dumb opinions it doesn’t mean you’re being persecuted. Conservatives are such babies I’m so tired of this shit
ashtonkem 6y ago
> Specific to the pandemic, no one wants to wear a mask. This is another one of those situations where the crazies are driving the conversation, because they are much louder than their actual portion of the population. According to Gallup the portion of their panel who “never” wear a mask outside of their home is 10%, while those who “rarely” wear a mask is 2%. The vast majority of the population wears masks “always” (50%), “very often” (27%), or at least “sometimes” (11%). The vast majority of us are complying with mask regulations; we’re just not making a lot of noise about it.
- bluntfang 6y ago
  while the 12% that never/rarely wear a mask reflects your "vast majority of the population wears masks" statement, 12% is very significant.
- EForEndeavour 6y ago
  Are those Gallup results national-level? If so, then we all know that the 12% of "never or rarely" mask-wearers are unevenly distributed.
- MegaButts 6y ago
  https://www.smbc-comics.com/comic/2013-04-07 https://www.smbc-comics.com/comic/2013-04-07
  - anigbrowl 6y ago
    That's a nice sentiment, but it's built on the idea that one should just ignore the crazies and they'll automatically be marginalized. It doesn't address the situation where one big group decides to weaponize its finge contingent, or where an angry fringe forces itself into what was intended to be a less heated conversations, as in this recent example: https://www.npr.org/2020/08/25/905785548/unmasked-protesters-push-past-police-into-idaho-lawmakers-session https://www.npr.org/2020/08/25/905785548/unmasked-protesters... They repeated the stunt approximately yesterday but one of the organizers was arrested this time; he handcuffed himself to a chair but didn't consider that it was on wheels, so they just rolled him out of the building. https://www.npr.org/2020/08/25/906046911/ammon-bundy-is-arrested-and-wheeled-out-of-the-idaho-statehouse https://www.npr.org/2020/08/25/906046911/ammon-bundy-is-arre...
itronitron 6y ago
A lot of US history boils down to criminals and cult leaders, whereas Europe is mostly about spoiled brats.
TT3351 6y ago
Wilding of America by Charles Derber is one text on this subject. It's an interesting theory. In another interpretation, the end of the frontier has also meant that the barbarism and roguery once relegated to the periphery of the country is now omnipresent.

Dirlewanger 6y ago

Interesting take. I've always held that Americans only care about those that they can see from the edge of their property line (neighbors and whatnot). Everyone else? Fuck em. Distrust of all forms of government is practically bred into us, and it shows at all levels. Corporations have pretty much filled that power vacuum.

ryandrake 6y ago
Plus, we Americans embrace or at least excuse this corporate power. Elected government tries to control what we can say online? Censorship! Overreach! Unaccountable Facebook and Twitter try to control what we say online? Yes, please! No problem! If you don't like it, leave! It's not censorship because corporate power is doing it rather than government power!
- cooljacob204 6y ago
  While I somewhat agree with the sentiment, there is a big difference between our government which has the power to take away our rights and a corporation censoring us.
  - bluntfang 6y ago
    Is there a big difference though? Especially considering we got Zucked into believing that TikTok needs to be banned/sold to an American company?
- toiletfuneral 6y ago
  Just because people don’t want to hear your dumb opinions it doesn’t mean you’re being persecuted. Conservatives are such babies I’m so tired of this shit

ashtonkem 6y ago

> Specific to the pandemic, no one wants to wear a mask. This is another one of those situations where the crazies are driving the conversation, because they are much louder than their actual portion of the population. According to Gallup the portion of their panel who “never” wear a mask outside of their home is 10%, while those who “rarely” wear a mask is 2%. The vast majority of the population wears masks “always” (50%), “very often” (27%), or at least “sometimes” (11%). The vast majority of us are complying with mask regulations; we’re just not making a lot of noise about it.

bluntfang 6y ago
while the 12% that never/rarely wear a mask reflects your "vast majority of the population wears masks" statement, 12% is very significant.
EForEndeavour 6y ago
Are those Gallup results national-level? If so, then we all know that the 12% of "never or rarely" mask-wearers are unevenly distributed.
MegaButts 6y ago
https://www.smbc-comics.com/comic/2013-04-07 https://www.smbc-comics.com/comic/2013-04-07
- anigbrowl 6y ago
  That's a nice sentiment, but it's built on the idea that one should just ignore the crazies and they'll automatically be marginalized. It doesn't address the situation where one big group decides to weaponize its finge contingent, or where an angry fringe forces itself into what was intended to be a less heated conversations, as in this recent example: https://www.npr.org/2020/08/25/905785548/unmasked-protesters-push-past-police-into-idaho-lawmakers-session https://www.npr.org/2020/08/25/905785548/unmasked-protesters... They repeated the stunt approximately yesterday but one of the organizers was arrested this time; he handcuffed himself to a chair but didn't consider that it was on wheels, so they just rolled him out of the building. https://www.npr.org/2020/08/25/906046911/ammon-bundy-is-arrested-and-wheeled-out-of-the-idaho-statehouse https://www.npr.org/2020/08/25/906046911/ammon-bundy-is-arre...

itronitron 6y ago

A lot of US history boils down to criminals and cult leaders, whereas Europe is mostly about spoiled brats.

TT3351 6y ago

Wilding of America by Charles Derber is one text on this subject. It's an interesting theory. In another interpretation, the end of the frontier has also meant that the barbarism and roguery once relegated to the periphery of the country is now omnipresent.