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then those merchants should use the widely popular 3d secure system, which lets you enter a pin. by using it, they are protected from reversals by the terms of

then those merchants should use the widely popular 3d secure system, which lets you enter a pin. by using it, they are protected from reversals by the terms of service. so a system that prevents them losing a gazillion dollars is available, and they opt to instead lose the gazillion dollars. it's their fault, and they should lose that money. we don't need to tell them anything -we just need to point and laugh.

strbean 6y ago
See quelltext's response. Or, have your customers ditch you for the convenience of Target/Walmart/etc. who can afford to eat the losses rather than make the checkout process more painful.
quelltext 6y ago
And then see customers complaining about the annoying extra steps. 3D Secure affects conversion rates adversely which means customers are generally happier without it and don't mind the fraud risk (as is consistent with the rest of this discussion on the thread).
- wst_ 6y ago
  There is next iteration of 3DS rolling out right now. Many countries adopted it already. It's designed, among other things, to minimize the friction for the buyers.
  - quelltext 6y ago
    Yeah, you're right. I was mostly talking about the past/status quo.
- vasachi 6y ago
  Really? In Russia I haven’t seen a single store without 3D Secure for a loooong time. And they are doing quite fine. Maybe it’s just that US customers are lazy?
  - seppel 6y ago
    They sometimes trying it in German but I bail out when I'm asked to jump through this extra hoops.
- alkonaut 6y ago
  > And then see customers complaining about the annoying extra steps. PIN in stores and 2FA online is already the norm in the developed world. It didn't exactly cause a disaster for retail. There are a few countries where it still isn't completely rolled out (US being the most notable one) but those are now outliers. > customers are generally happier without it Again I think this perspectivve is US centric and not global (?).
  - GoblinSlayer 6y ago
    Will americans even notice it? Alexa already makes all payments on their behalf over the sound. Or was it Siri?
  - quelltext 6y ago
    > Again I think this perspectivve is US centric and not global (?). I'm not in the US or talking about the US per se. I as a customer want 3D Secure because I don't want to deal with fraud at all but AFAIK it's not that liked among users. And I did run into issues where the 2FA setup my bank offered took a physical letter to initialize/reset and I couldn't actually buy flight tickets I quickly needed (ended up changing cards). So I can sort of see how people can get a bit annoyed as long as 3D Secure is a bit frictionful. Online businesses would like it if it helps them avoid fraud as well. The problem is that conversion rates drop and so only few businesses implement/enforce it unless it's the law (see EU). Given how simple it is for a customer to ask for a chargeback I don't think there's a clear winner here for using 3D Secure except for acquirers and brands. Issuers don't really gain anything either given their already strong position when handling chargebacks.

strbean 6y ago

See quelltext's response. Or, have your customers ditch you for the convenience of Target/Walmart/etc. who can afford to eat the losses rather than make the checkout process more painful.

quelltext 6y ago

And then see customers complaining about the annoying extra steps. 3D Secure affects conversion rates adversely which means customers are generally happier without it and don't mind the fraud risk (as is consistent with the rest of this discussion on the thread).

wst_ 6y ago
There is next iteration of 3DS rolling out right now. Many countries adopted it already. It's designed, among other things, to minimize the friction for the buyers.
- quelltext 6y ago
  Yeah, you're right. I was mostly talking about the past/status quo.
vasachi 6y ago
Really? In Russia I haven’t seen a single store without 3D Secure for a loooong time. And they are doing quite fine. Maybe it’s just that US customers are lazy?
- seppel 6y ago
  They sometimes trying it in German but I bail out when I'm asked to jump through this extra hoops.
alkonaut 6y ago
> And then see customers complaining about the annoying extra steps. PIN in stores and 2FA online is already the norm in the developed world. It didn't exactly cause a disaster for retail. There are a few countries where it still isn't completely rolled out (US being the most notable one) but those are now outliers. > customers are generally happier without it Again I think this perspectivve is US centric and not global (?).
- GoblinSlayer 6y ago
  Will americans even notice it? Alexa already makes all payments on their behalf over the sound. Or was it Siri?
- quelltext 6y ago
  > Again I think this perspectivve is US centric and not global (?). I'm not in the US or talking about the US per se. I as a customer want 3D Secure because I don't want to deal with fraud at all but AFAIK it's not that liked among users. And I did run into issues where the 2FA setup my bank offered took a physical letter to initialize/reset and I couldn't actually buy flight tickets I quickly needed (ended up changing cards). So I can sort of see how people can get a bit annoyed as long as 3D Secure is a bit frictionful. Online businesses would like it if it helps them avoid fraud as well. The problem is that conversion rates drop and so only few businesses implement/enforce it unless it's the law (see EU). Given how simple it is for a customer to ask for a chargeback I don't think there's a clear winner here for using 3D Secure except for acquirers and brands. Issuers don't really gain anything either given their already strong position when handling chargebacks.