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Alberta government gives green light to Calgary-Edmonton Hyperloop project
- 1235711 6y agoAh yes Alberta where even roads don't work thanks to freeze thaw cycles. What a perfect start.
- maerF0x0 6y agoI recall better roads in Alberta than San Francisco + hwy 101 in bay area.
- samatman 6y agoThe thing about pavement in the Bay Area: it breaks all at once. I remember this striking me suddenly, shortly after I moved out from the Midwest. I was sitting on a patio, idly tracing the cracks with my eyes, when a question sort of bubbled up: where did they come from? The ground never freezes. Then it hit me: in this case, they came from 1989.
- cycop 6y agoThe highway should be an 8 lane freeway, however it is a 4 lane death trap. Anything to get more cars off this road.
- cmrdporcupine 6y agoReally? Last few times I've driven it I remember thinking how much milder (well, also boring) of an experience it was than driving the 401 in Ontario. Now, in the heart of February with black ice everywhere, that's maybe a different story. But not sure more lanes would help.
- johnwalkr 6y agoAs I always comment on threads like these, one of the supposed benefits that make hyperloop cheaper than rail is lack of expansion joints. The tube floats axially except halfway between each station where it is fixed. There's only one sensible in between station (Red Deer), putting each section of tube at 75km. If steel and assuming -40C to +60C temperature range (taking a guess at the tube's temperature on a hot day), you need +/- 27m for thermal expansion at each station. This needs to somehow maintain a vacuum seal and is also where you are boarding people, presumably through airlocks. Sure, there could be solutions but I don't find it credible that the feasibility is higher than a train.
- maerF0x0 6y agoTypical drivers can do the trip in ~2.5hrs. Mind you that is door to door w/ your actual destination. Depending on regulations (similar to preflight security), this could be a 1 hour trip. If you need to also take a taxi to and from the hyperloop, you're not looking at much time savings. IMO the real value of these options is that you can do something else in the mean time. You can read, you can make calls, you can sleep. Also: Obligatory monorail comment for hyper loop: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZDOI0cq6GZM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZDOI0cq6GZM
- cmrdporcupine 6y agoNot sure why you're getting downvoted, downvoting isn't for disagreement, it's for etiquette violations, etc. I agree this is not the most sensible locale to test this. There used to be frequent VIA rail service between the two cities (I remember taking it as a kid, at least as far as Innisfail to visit my grandpa) and I believe that's gone, due to lack of demand. The cities are close enough that driving isn't terrible. Now, it does have rather flat and easy to deal with topography, so there's that. Toronto to Montreal / Ottawa, that's a route where high speed rail is desperately needed. Even more so if it was extended to come from Detroit and/or Buffalo. If we're sticking with Alberta, maybe Edmonton to Fort McMurray, to get oil workers to/from the north. That's a crappy drive, and long.
- ebg13 6y ago> Not sure why you're getting downvoted It was downvoted already before I got here, but I personally loathe "obligatory simpsons/xkcd/etc" and "does/did anyone else <irrelevant thing>?" meme noise comments in article discussion threads. Probably others dislike it too and consider it an "etiquette violation", as you put it.
- maerF0x0 6y agonext time I'll put the obligatory part last, so the real comment can be better seen. You did read the whole comment, right?
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- perardi 6y agoLet’s look at the actual text of the article. “Toronto-based startup TransPod has signed a memorandum of understanding with the government to study the potential of a high-speed hyperloop system and help it attract investors.” And let’s translate that from polite Canadian PR speak: this will never, ever, ever happen, but it sounds nice, so we’ll put it out there.
- cycop 6y agoProjected 8 to 10 billion? , will end up being 25-billion at the low end.
- perardi 6y agoIn a province that is quite broke, and led by a retrograde politician who only thinks of oil. Unless this also happens to transport heavy crude, this will not happen.
- cmrdporcupine 6y agoI suspect in the end it's ... they can test development of this in Alberta because it's a locale which is super "business friendly" (read low taxes, low regulations). Doesn't mean it will ever actually get built, though.
- vmception 6y agoan MoU lol
- perardi 6y agoA memorandum of understanding from a startup to create a capital-intensive public transit system in a time where existing public transit is in severe financial distress, in a province that is in severe financial distress, and also one that loves its pickup trucks. Sure.
- perardi 6y agoAnd before you say “you’re just a cynic, you have to believe in the power of disruption”, I want you to study the vast cost overruns and cost-disease of every public transit project of note in Canada in recent memory, and then tell me how magic startup fairy dust will cut through sclerotic governments both municipal, provincial, and federal. We barely made Presto cards work.
- GaryNumanVevo 6y agoThe Saudi funded Hyperloop project should be a good litmus test for Hyperloops around the world. It's ideal: across flat land, no mountains / tunnels, lots of money behind it. Not sure how far along they are in construction though. https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-49096675 https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-49096675
- bearcobra 6y agoI don't think this project will happen, but it has some similar characteristics. Two cities with metro populations over 1 million that are separated by approximately 300kms of flat, sparsely populated land seems like a perfect test case.
- jariel 6y agoActually, it would be for once a benefit to the world for them to burn billions on the first iteration because it will be extra costly.
- osipovas 6y agoAs an Albertan living in Edmonton and as per the feasibility study mentioned in the article, I don't think this is happening. That said, if by some miracle it does happen, that would be awesome!
- cmorgan8506 6y agoAlso Albertan. Maybe it's unrealistic but I agree it would be pretty awesome to see in my lifetime. Would also be cool to see Alberta get on the map for something other than oil.
- dblohm7 6y agoYet another Albertan. I would expect the AB government to not directly fund something like this. P3? Privately owned and operated? Still unlikely.
- sbierwagen 6y agoNote that TransPod is the maglev vactrain variant of hyperloop, distinct from the air bearing system in the original hyperloop white paper. This avoids new technology, and lets you use existing COTS maglev track, but... would be more expensive per mile than air bearings. Curious choice for a train in Alberta. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TransPod https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TransPod As other commentors have noted, this is a pre-pre-pre announcement. They're not even talking about breaking ground for another 5 years.
- beloch 6y agoThe new development appears to be that the province is allowing the test track to be built on crown land in a place where it could become a part of the full line, if actually built. Previously, the test track would need to be removed even if the line went ahead. While it's still unlikely a full hyperloop line will be built, this agreement does goose the odds upwards slightly at little public cost, provided precautions are put in place to ensure the company building the test line does actually pay for its removal if the full line is not built.
- bluGill 6y agoThe artist drawing doesn't seem to have enough support for the span between pillars. It looks nice but not realistic
- loceng 6y agoThis isn't Elon's Hyperloop for those wondering. The term Hyperloop's been misappropriated and applied to different technology to piggyback on the hype Elon caused.
- Alupis 6y agoNo, that's wrong. "Hyperloop" was never going to work, so Musk spun it off into this "competition" that still has people trying to figure out some way to make something that even resembles his original mutterings. Today, this almost always manifests itself as a maglev train in a tube. This way, Musk saves face by not failing publically. If the idea fails, he can just say "It was in your hands, I left the idea with you!" Pretty clever exploit...
- loceng 6y agoQuite the mental gymnastics you've done to put down an idea, while presenting no evidence as to why it won't work. Go to boringcompany.com to see what they're currently up to + they've had competition for university teams to develop the skate that you're vehicle would be accelerated by in the Hyperloop. Elon has the engineering team, along with himself, from SpaceX to reference and understand the physics of the tunnel transportation systems they are developing.
- legolas2412 6y agoboring company is not building hyperloop. The urban loop or the boring company loops are just small tunnels. Nor is spacex building anything, but a small tunnel to do pod design competitions. Many things are wrong with the hyperloop or loop proposals. The first is that they are unproven and wildly off cost estimate. Elon musk waived off hyperloop costs by declaring that they can be built along pylons on existing highways. But that's absurd, as existing highways are built to the standard of 70-80 mph, and for the proposed speeds of 400-500 mph, the curvatures of the road, and the twists and the turns are completely different. Hence, land acquisition costs do not go away. The same thing applies to boring company's loop. If you are going to zip at 150mph, the curvatures are steep, and any common tunnel will slow it down. I watched a few videos doing a more thorough analysis. If you're interested, I'll try to find and share them.
- Mister_Snuggles 6y agoI live in Alberta. There is no way this will be economically viable in the short term. Here's what this is competing with: Driving from Edmonton to Calgary, downtown to downtown, takes about 3 hours. My car can do a round trip on a single tank of gas with enough left over to do a little running around. The cost is about $60 in fuel, an unknown amount of wear-and-tear on the car, and three hours of time. I've done this trip with four people, so that works out $25/person assuming $40 worth of wear-and-tear on the car. The depreciation and insurance costs are not a factor here since those happen regardless. If you don't own a car, but have a driver's license, you can pick up a Communauto (our version of ZipCar/Car2Go/etc) and drive it down there. This would probably cost less than $100, and Communauto includes fuel, insurance, and maintenance, but the cars in their fleet aren't necessarily ones that I'd choose for a road trip. The flight from Edmonton to Calgary takes about 45 minutes from takeoff to landing. You need to arrive at the airport 1.5-2 hours before takeoff. Plus you need to get to the airport at the start of your trip and to your destination at the end. The cost is between $100 and $300 depending on how far you plan ahead, plus three hours of time. There is currently no passenger rail service between Edmonton and Calgary. There is bus service between the two cities. Red Arrow runs between Edmonton and Calgary and isn't too bad. You still have to get to the bus terminal at the start and your destination at the end, but the terminals may be in walking distance if you're going downtown to downtown. The cost is $172 plus three hours of time. To work, this needs to find the sweet spot of taking less time than driving, being less of an annoyance than air travel, and priced right to make up for its own set of shortcomings. $25 per person plus three hours is a really tough price to beat.
- 908B64B197 6y agoSounds like improving airport security and getting to and from the airport would pretty much solve the issues here.
- jariel 6y agoMost people drive alone, not in groups. With traffic it's more than 3 hours. That doesn't count insurance, cost of car, wear and tear. 3 hours is ugly, though 4-5 would be a sweeter spot. If the tube works downtown to downtown in 45 minutes, people will pay $80 a ticket no problem. Honestly the bigger problem is that Edmonton/Calgary 'downtown' is still 'nowhere' ... you need a car when you get there, it ain't Paris or Munich. What Calgary/Edmonton needs is a fast train that connects to other, more local fast trains and commuters and light rail.