4 ms·

I completed the interview process at Jane Street last year and received a verbal offer after my on-site which they then proceeded to rescind while we were discu

by jolux 6y ago

I completed the interview process at Jane Street last year and received a verbal offer after my on-site which they then proceeded to rescind while we were discussing pay ranges, claiming they had decided instead to fill the position I applied for with internal staff. Their recruiter handled it with a high degree of professionalism but the experience left a bad taste in my mouth nonetheless.

kyawzazaw 6y ago
Maybe I am not too familiar with it (although I have heard interns negotiating for pay with Akuna). I thought intern compensation is pretty much set. Did you have counter offers to negotiate?
- jolux 6y ago
  It was an engineering position, not an internship.
rtlfe 6y ago
What kind of position was that for? Must not have been a generalist software engineer if there was only one slot available.
- jolux 6y ago
  I’m a little wary of disclosing in case they read this but it’s probably rare enough that they would know from the description anyways. I will say it’s a software position and it remains on their careers page as open.
PragmaticPulp 6y ago
Sorry to hear about your experience. I have to ask: Who gave you the verbal offer? Was it an internal recruiter, external recruiter, or the company's HR department? I mentor a lot of college students. They're always very nervous about the possibility of rescinded offers despite how rare it is in practice, so I'm curious about the details of your situation. When mentoring people, I always advise people to never assume an offer is a done deal until you've received the official offer letter with compensation details and a start date. Unethical recruiters are notorious for misleading candidates into thinking the job is a sure thing in order to discourage them from interviewing elsewhere. When mentoring hiring managers, I emphasize the importance of never misleading candidates into thinking they have a job until we send the official offer letter. It's common for new hiring managers to get so excited that they give the candidate too much information too early. Even simple statements like, "We were really impressed with your performance and now I'm going to work on getting you an offer" can be disastrously misleading to candidates who don't realize that their interviewer/recruiter isn't the only decision maker in the process.
- jolux 6y ago
  Internal recruiter. Thankfully, I didn’t assume it was a done deal, because it wasn’t in writing yet, so I still had opportunities in flight elsewhere.
- chrisseaton 6y ago
  > I always advise people to never assume an offer is a done deal until you've received the official offer letter with compensation details and a start date They can still rescind at that stage as well though can't they - it's no more concrete, legally, is it?
  - wolco 6y ago
    You could sue at that point.
    - bigwavedave 6y ago
      For what, exercising the "at-will employment" clause that's in most non-contractor employment contracts? You could no more sue them at that point than they could sue an employee for not giving two-weeks notice. Please don't spread misinformation.
      - wolco 6y ago
        In Canada this is not true and can be backed up with cases. If you live in an at-will state I completely understand you would have few rights. An employer can sue you for two weeks and any damages that comes from that event.
        Kranar 6y ago
        You mention Canada as though we have one unified set of laws, but that is not the case. In Ontario, for example, I can fire an employee without cause prior to their first day of work or even on their first day of work but before they official start and I am not required to pay them anything. To the best of my knowledge, most of Canada follows the same rules and the only province that is likely to differ about this is Quebec.
sokoloff 6y ago
> received a verbal offer after my on-site which they then proceeded to rescind while we were discussing pay ranges I would think that compensation would be a required element of an employment offer. (I wouldn't say that I'd received a job offer if it didn't also include compensation information. If I didn't agree to the proposed figures and decided to negotiate, then I'd received a job offer that I declined.)
- jolux 6y ago
  There was a number discussed, it just wasn’t final, hence not written.

by jolux 6y ago

kyawzazaw 6y ago

Maybe I am not too familiar with it (although I have heard interns negotiating for pay with Akuna). I thought intern compensation is pretty much set. Did you have counter offers to negotiate?

jolux 6y ago
It was an engineering position, not an internship.

rtlfe 6y ago

What kind of position was that for? Must not have been a generalist software engineer if there was only one slot available.

jolux 6y ago
I’m a little wary of disclosing in case they read this but it’s probably rare enough that they would know from the description anyways. I will say it’s a software position and it remains on their careers page as open.

PragmaticPulp 6y ago

Sorry to hear about your experience. I have to ask: Who gave you the verbal offer? Was it an internal recruiter, external recruiter, or the company's HR department? I mentor a lot of college students. They're always very nervous about the possibility of rescinded offers despite how rare it is in practice, so I'm curious about the details of your situation. When mentoring people, I always advise people to never assume an offer is a done deal until you've received the official offer letter with compensation details and a start date. Unethical recruiters are notorious for misleading candidates into thinking the job is a sure thing in order to discourage them from interviewing elsewhere. When mentoring hiring managers, I emphasize the importance of never misleading candidates into thinking they have a job until we send the official offer letter. It's common for new hiring managers to get so excited that they give the candidate too much information too early. Even simple statements like, "We were really impressed with your performance and now I'm going to work on getting you an offer" can be disastrously misleading to candidates who don't realize that their interviewer/recruiter isn't the only decision maker in the process.

jolux 6y ago
Internal recruiter. Thankfully, I didn’t assume it was a done deal, because it wasn’t in writing yet, so I still had opportunities in flight elsewhere.
chrisseaton 6y ago
> I always advise people to never assume an offer is a done deal until you've received the official offer letter with compensation details and a start date They can still rescind at that stage as well though can't they - it's no more concrete, legally, is it?
- wolco 6y ago
  You could sue at that point.
  - bigwavedave 6y ago
    For what, exercising the "at-will employment" clause that's in most non-contractor employment contracts? You could no more sue them at that point than they could sue an employee for not giving two-weeks notice. Please don't spread misinformation.
    - wolco 6y ago
      In Canada this is not true and can be backed up with cases. If you live in an at-will state I completely understand you would have few rights. An employer can sue you for two weeks and any damages that comes from that event.
      - Kranar 6y ago
        You mention Canada as though we have one unified set of laws, but that is not the case. In Ontario, for example, I can fire an employee without cause prior to their first day of work or even on their first day of work but before they official start and I am not required to pay them anything. To the best of my knowledge, most of Canada follows the same rules and the only province that is likely to differ about this is Quebec.

sokoloff 6y ago

> received a verbal offer after my on-site which they then proceeded to rescind while we were discussing pay ranges I would think that compensation would be a required element of an employment offer. (I wouldn't say that I'd received a job offer if it didn't also include compensation information. If I didn't agree to the proposed figures and decided to negotiate, then I'd received a job offer that I declined.)

jolux 6y ago
There was a number discussed, it just wasn’t final, hence not written.