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This is a problem for Intel on four fronts at the same time: - x86-CPUs from AMD with better efficiency in Desktop and Datacenter - Apple-ARM Macbooks showing

This is a problem for Intel on four fronts at the same time: - x86-CPUs from AMD with better efficiency in Desktop and Datacenter - Apple-ARM Macbooks showing that it doesnt have to be x86 at all - x86-APUs from AMD with Navi-GPUs versus Intel Xe - Intel Xe as Compute vs. NVidia Cards. All of these pivot around Intel at least matching the process of their competitiors. Also, Intel has optimized 14nm that much, that their initial yields and performance gains on 10nm and 7nm will probably piss-poor initially.

zucker42 6y ago
On the last two points, aren't there rumors that Intel is going to build some of its Intel Xe graphics cards using TSMC?
- ksec 6y ago
  Only for 1 Specific Xe GPU SKUs. It is too late to change and port the design to TSMC and risk even further delay. ( Not to mention TSMC doesn't have spare capacity siting around )
cma 6y ago
Doesn't Intel use TSMC for Xe? And Nvidia uses Samsung for Ampere I think.
- teach 6y ago
  The rumors I've heard are that Nvidia wanted to use TSMC's 7nm process for Ampere, but AMD had bought all their spare capacity, so they had to "fall back" to Samsung's 8nm. I suspect this is why Ampere is gonna run hot and consume a lot of power relative to AMD's GPU showing this cycle.
bgorman 6y ago
It is not as big of a problem as you think for 3 reasons. 1. Intel has purchased capacity from TSMC which will presumably be used for Xe HPC. 2. TSMC does not have enough capacity for AMD to take significant market share 3. Intel still has a lock on high margin datacenter parts
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- JoshTko 6y ago
  TSMC is is only going to give Intel unused capacity, essentially lowest priority for a few reasons. 1. Intel will drop TSMC the moment their fabs start working as expected - so you don't want to depend on Intel orders at all. High margin orders one quarter that are gone the next will not help TSMC's business long term. 2. TSMC has enough demand from other companies - they even turned down NVIDIA for most of their GPUs 3. A weaker Intel allows TSMC to command higher margins long term. helping keep Intel while it's still a massive competitor makes no strategic sense.

zucker42 6y ago

On the last two points, aren't there rumors that Intel is going to build some of its Intel Xe graphics cards using TSMC?

ksec 6y ago
Only for 1 Specific Xe GPU SKUs. It is too late to change and port the design to TSMC and risk even further delay. ( Not to mention TSMC doesn't have spare capacity siting around )

cma 6y ago

Doesn't Intel use TSMC for Xe? And Nvidia uses Samsung for Ampere I think.

teach 6y ago
The rumors I've heard are that Nvidia wanted to use TSMC's 7nm process for Ampere, but AMD had bought all their spare capacity, so they had to "fall back" to Samsung's 8nm. I suspect this is why Ampere is gonna run hot and consume a lot of power relative to AMD's GPU showing this cycle.

bgorman 6y ago

It is not as big of a problem as you think for 3 reasons. 1. Intel has purchased capacity from TSMC which will presumably be used for Xe HPC. 2. TSMC does not have enough capacity for AMD to take significant market share 3. Intel still has a lock on high margin datacenter parts

deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
JoshTko 6y ago
TSMC is is only going to give Intel unused capacity, essentially lowest priority for a few reasons. 1. Intel will drop TSMC the moment their fabs start working as expected - so you don't want to depend on Intel orders at all. High margin orders one quarter that are gone the next will not help TSMC's business long term. 2. TSMC has enough demand from other companies - they even turned down NVIDIA for most of their GPUs 3. A weaker Intel allows TSMC to command higher margins long term. helping keep Intel while it's still a massive competitor makes no strategic sense.