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> Privacy LARPers are a tiny segment of the market, the average person doesn’t really care if their ‘usage of the highlighter function is tracked’ If so, why d

by neiman 6y ago

> Privacy LARPers are a tiny segment of the market, the average person doesn’t really care if their ‘usage of the highlighter function is tracked’ If so, why don't they loudly advertise the data collection and do it only with opt-in? It's not that the average user doesn't care if they're tracked, it's that they're not aware that they're being tracked.

jjcon 6y ago
You think companies should loudly advertise something people don’t care about? That doesn’t make sense. Plenty of companies are quite transparent about their data collection practices (set up an Apple device recently?) Most people are aware of data collection, they care more about functionality though.
- neiman 6y ago
  > You think companies should loudly advertise something people don’t care about? It's not what I said.
  - jjcon 6y ago
    > why don't they loudly advertise the data collection
    - neiman 6y ago
      This I wrote. I didn't write "companies should loudly advertise something people don’t care about" -> you added something to my sentence, taking it out of context. I wrote my opinion already, but I'll repeat it anyway in case it was not clear. I think you can't know if people care about it or not, as long as they're not informed about it.
- shadowprofile77 6y ago
  >Plenty of companies are quite transparent about their data collection practices (set up an Apple device recently?) I have not, not recently, but what you say is simply bullshit. They're "transparent" in that they give you a ToS loaded with legalese that they know you couldn't easily read through to find just how much and where they're squeezing your life for information to store. In cases where they simplify this with some less legalistic declarations of data use, what you often see there are numerous weasel words and phrases to very ambiguously describe what's being done. You know, things like "We MAY collect some information for the sake of improving user experience" and blah blah.... Then of course, there's the outright lying, which also happens, in which big tech companies simply fail to mention some types of data collection anywhere (the Amazon Alexa voice recordings being listened to by humans is a good example iof this)
  - jjcon 6y ago
    This isn’t buried in a tos or legalese https://www.groundctl.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/csm_IMG_0111_0bbd160c33.jpg https://www.groundctl.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/csm_IMG... Apple prompts you for each piece of data collection during the setup of an iOS device (and lets you choose if you want to share).
    - t-writescode 6y ago
      You're presenting the shining example in the corporate world of responsibility with customer data, Apple, with every other company and saying that everyone does it this way? Most companies hide it in legalese. Some companies claim they're not sending any data and then send it anyway. Looking at you Philips Hue lights.
rumanator 6y ago
> If so, why don't they loudly advertise the data collection and do it only with opt-in? But they do. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=yg70ojfWXnk https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=yg70ojfWXnk
- neiman 6y ago
  The video is about synch, while the conversation is about "collection does lead to better products" -> i.e, analytics.
  - rumanator 6y ago
    What do you believe syncing means? This discussion talks about whispersync reporting last page read and most recent page read events. What do you think that's supposed to do?
    - neiman 6y ago
      Syncing and analytics are not identical, sorry.
      - rumanator 6y ago
        You're the only one fabricating accusations about "analysing" in a discussion about how Kindles send data with whispersync, a system widely known to be used to sync data across devices. More importantly, the only usecase mentioned in the discussion that resembles anything like analysis is synching page reads across devices, and tracking reading progress to compensate authors who make their books available through subscription services. Either you know stuff about "analysing" that for some reason you're keeping a secret, or you're talking nonsense about stuff you have no grasp over.
        neiman 6y ago
        Please read the message beginning this thread. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24271258 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24271258 It's written there: > "most of what's mentioned in this article are metrics used to understand how the features are used (bookmarks, highlights, dictionnary, etc.), how much they are used, and in which country." Besides, I don't appreciate phrases like "fabricating accusations" or "you're talking nonsense about stuff you have no grasp over". I'm may be wrong, it happens often, but even if I am this aggressive tone is not in place. You can point out my mistakes politely if they exist, same way as I do with yours.

by neiman 6y ago

jjcon 6y ago

You think companies should loudly advertise something people don’t care about? That doesn’t make sense. Plenty of companies are quite transparent about their data collection practices (set up an Apple device recently?) Most people are aware of data collection, they care more about functionality though.

neiman 6y ago
> You think companies should loudly advertise something people don’t care about? It's not what I said.
- jjcon 6y ago
  > why don't they loudly advertise the data collection
  - neiman 6y ago
    This I wrote. I didn't write "companies should loudly advertise something people don’t care about" -> you added something to my sentence, taking it out of context. I wrote my opinion already, but I'll repeat it anyway in case it was not clear. I think you can't know if people care about it or not, as long as they're not informed about it.
shadowprofile77 6y ago
>Plenty of companies are quite transparent about their data collection practices (set up an Apple device recently?) I have not, not recently, but what you say is simply bullshit. They're "transparent" in that they give you a ToS loaded with legalese that they know you couldn't easily read through to find just how much and where they're squeezing your life for information to store. In cases where they simplify this with some less legalistic declarations of data use, what you often see there are numerous weasel words and phrases to very ambiguously describe what's being done. You know, things like "We MAY collect some information for the sake of improving user experience" and blah blah.... Then of course, there's the outright lying, which also happens, in which big tech companies simply fail to mention some types of data collection anywhere (the Amazon Alexa voice recordings being listened to by humans is a good example iof this)
- jjcon 6y ago
  This isn’t buried in a tos or legalese https://www.groundctl.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/csm_IMG_0111_0bbd160c33.jpg https://www.groundctl.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/csm_IMG... Apple prompts you for each piece of data collection during the setup of an iOS device (and lets you choose if you want to share).
  - t-writescode 6y ago
    You're presenting the shining example in the corporate world of responsibility with customer data, Apple, with every other company and saying that everyone does it this way? Most companies hide it in legalese. Some companies claim they're not sending any data and then send it anyway. Looking at you Philips Hue lights.

rumanator 6y ago

> If so, why don't they loudly advertise the data collection and do it only with opt-in? But they do. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=yg70ojfWXnk https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=yg70ojfWXnk

neiman 6y ago
The video is about synch, while the conversation is about "collection does lead to better products" -> i.e, analytics.
- rumanator 6y ago
  What do you believe syncing means? This discussion talks about whispersync reporting last page read and most recent page read events. What do you think that's supposed to do?
  - neiman 6y ago
    Syncing and analytics are not identical, sorry.
    - rumanator 6y ago
      You're the only one fabricating accusations about "analysing" in a discussion about how Kindles send data with whispersync, a system widely known to be used to sync data across devices. More importantly, the only usecase mentioned in the discussion that resembles anything like analysis is synching page reads across devices, and tracking reading progress to compensate authors who make their books available through subscription services. Either you know stuff about "analysing" that for some reason you're keeping a secret, or you're talking nonsense about stuff you have no grasp over.
      - neiman 6y ago
        Please read the message beginning this thread. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24271258 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24271258 It's written there: > "most of what's mentioned in this article are metrics used to understand how the features are used (bookmarks, highlights, dictionnary, etc.), how much they are used, and in which country." Besides, I don't appreciate phrases like "fabricating accusations" or "you're talking nonsense about stuff you have no grasp over". I'm may be wrong, it happens often, but even if I am this aggressive tone is not in place. You can point out my mistakes politely if they exist, same way as I do with yours.