3 ms·

Even if the developers take the egregious step of nerfing airplane mode, you can still "opt out" by not giving the device credentials for your WiFi network.

gvjddbnvdrbv 6y ago
Only a matter of time before devices come with 5G data connections...
- mikro2nd 6y ago
  ...which would require a valid SIM. So just don't add one. If the device comes with a pre-inserted/hardwired/virtual SIM, well... several countries in the world require KYC-style registration of the SIM owner before networks are allowed to activate the SIM, so there'd still be an opt-out path for the user in such countries. eta: My point being: Now you're in a twisty little maze full of corner cases, all different. Not the sort of thing much loved by Amazon (or any of the GRAFT).
  - gvjddbnvdrbv 6y ago
    Does this work with Teslas?
  - falcolas 6y ago
    FWIW, the original kindle used a cellular connection to do position syncing and book downloading. No user-provided SIM needed.
  - PeterStuer 6y ago
    Not in the IoT world. The 'owner' of the Sim, the company that sells the device, would have a deal with one or more network providers to allow access, and take care of facilitating data retention and identification regulation.
- falcolas 6y ago
  AKA, the original whispersync. Yup, this was once a thing - you didn't need wifi for sync or downloading books at all.
  - iso1631 6y ago
    Kindles at one point apparently came with free cellular access https://xkcd.com/548/ https://xkcd.com/548/
    - sct202 6y ago
      I had a kindle keyboard and it had 3g. It worked in a bunch of countries--slowly though. I remember reading blogs where people were taking the sim cards out and tethering using them.
    - int_19h 6y ago
      They still do - it's an option on more expensive devices (Paperwhite and Oasis).
- vhold 6y ago
  To save money they could come with LoRA radios and sync when the opportunity arrises to a LoRA gateway, including meshing with each other to aggregate data to increase the likeliness of encountering a gateway. LoRA modules are pretty cheap. https://www.thethingsnetwork.org/ https://www.thethingsnetwork.org/
kofejnik 6y ago
Only until you come into range of any open WiFi which is every public place everywhere
- whynotminot 6y ago
  Is that Kindle that promiscuous that it will literally connect to any open AP without prompting?
  - hibbelig 6y ago
    Here on hn, I read several stories where smart TVs did exactly that: they tried all available wifi networks to see if one of them worked. It doesn't seem so far-fetched that the Kindle might, too.
    - whynotminot 6y ago
      Sure, but I'm looking for an answer and not idle speculation.
  - falcolas 6y ago
    As of my current device (the Oasis), no, it does not appear to be this promiscuous. I can't speak to the analytics, but the whispersync and book downloading doesn't work unless you explicitly connect it to an AP.
  - kofejnik 6y ago
    Parent comment was > if the developers take the egregious step of nerfing airplane mode, and I was responding that IF the developers decide to nerf the airplane mode it's very possible they will start using any open AP; some TV's are reportedly doing this already
    - whynotminot 6y ago
      Ok so you don't know, you're just speculating without evidence.

gvjddbnvdrbv 6y ago

Only a matter of time before devices come with 5G data connections...

mikro2nd 6y ago
...which would require a valid SIM. So just don't add one. If the device comes with a pre-inserted/hardwired/virtual SIM, well... several countries in the world require KYC-style registration of the SIM owner before networks are allowed to activate the SIM, so there'd still be an opt-out path for the user in such countries. eta: My point being: Now you're in a twisty little maze full of corner cases, all different. Not the sort of thing much loved by Amazon (or any of the GRAFT).
- gvjddbnvdrbv 6y ago
  Does this work with Teslas?
- falcolas 6y ago
  FWIW, the original kindle used a cellular connection to do position syncing and book downloading. No user-provided SIM needed.
- PeterStuer 6y ago
  Not in the IoT world. The 'owner' of the Sim, the company that sells the device, would have a deal with one or more network providers to allow access, and take care of facilitating data retention and identification regulation.
falcolas 6y ago
AKA, the original whispersync. Yup, this was once a thing - you didn't need wifi for sync or downloading books at all.
- iso1631 6y ago
  Kindles at one point apparently came with free cellular access https://xkcd.com/548/ https://xkcd.com/548/
  - sct202 6y ago
    I had a kindle keyboard and it had 3g. It worked in a bunch of countries--slowly though. I remember reading blogs where people were taking the sim cards out and tethering using them.
  - int_19h 6y ago
    They still do - it's an option on more expensive devices (Paperwhite and Oasis).
vhold 6y ago
To save money they could come with LoRA radios and sync when the opportunity arrises to a LoRA gateway, including meshing with each other to aggregate data to increase the likeliness of encountering a gateway. LoRA modules are pretty cheap. https://www.thethingsnetwork.org/ https://www.thethingsnetwork.org/

kofejnik 6y ago

Only until you come into range of any open WiFi which is every public place everywhere

whynotminot 6y ago
Is that Kindle that promiscuous that it will literally connect to any open AP without prompting?
- hibbelig 6y ago
  Here on hn, I read several stories where smart TVs did exactly that: they tried all available wifi networks to see if one of them worked. It doesn't seem so far-fetched that the Kindle might, too.
  - whynotminot 6y ago
    Sure, but I'm looking for an answer and not idle speculation.
- falcolas 6y ago
  As of my current device (the Oasis), no, it does not appear to be this promiscuous. I can't speak to the analytics, but the whispersync and book downloading doesn't work unless you explicitly connect it to an AP.
- kofejnik 6y ago
  Parent comment was > if the developers take the egregious step of nerfing airplane mode, and I was responding that IF the developers decide to nerf the airplane mode it's very possible they will start using any open AP; some TV's are reportedly doing this already
  - whynotminot 6y ago
    Ok so you don't know, you're just speculating without evidence.