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"Protecting propety values" has been code for "keep out undesirable minorities" for a very long time, in the US.
by zymhan 6y ago
"Protecting propety values" has been code for "keep out undesirable minorities" for a very long time, in the US.
- nickff 6y agoI didn't say "protecting propety [sic] values", I said "protecting rich neighborhoods". If you'd like more details, I'd recommend reading the book, it is very detailed and well-written.
- TeaDrunk 6y agoOnly white people have had rich neighborhoods to protect. (When other races have such neighborhoods, they're burned to the ground.)
- nickff 6y agoI think you're engaging in rhetoric here, and it's not very convincing (to me).
- R0b0t1 6y agoRhetoric is typically effective, eloquent reasoning and speech.
- LarryDarrell 6y agoOr they were razed 'legally' for an eight lane freeway.
- ashtonkem 6y agoOr to create Central Park, which was previously a black neighborhood in NYC.
- selectodude 6y agoCentral Park was mostly a loose collection of shantytowns full of Irish people. There were evictions but it was not a large group of people, or anything resembling a neighborhood.
- jessaustin 6y agoI don't know the exact history, but this reads as something that can't possibly be true. Had the "Irish shantytowns" successfully excluded other minorities? If so, how? Is there any "shantytown" anywhere on earth that isn't populated much more densely than 1850s Manhattan? What makes a "shantytown" not resemble a neighborhood? Not enough picket fences?
- ashtonkem 6y ago"Shantytown" is usually more of a pejorative value judgement than an objective statement of fact.
- jessaustin 6y ago...hence the "scare quotes". b^)
- ashtonkem 6y ago> Central Park was mostly a loose collection of shantytowns full of Irish people. I wouldn't call a 50 year old neighborhood with 1,600 Irish and Black residents "not a large group of people". Calling that "not a neighborhood" is also an eyebrow raising population, especially given that Seneca Village had a large chunk of the (extremely rare) Black property owners in New York State. You have to be careful repeating historical claims of an area being a "shantytown", as sometimes that is less a statement of fact and more of a way to justify a negative or prejudiced opinion. Given that the same people who called Seneca Village a "shantytown" also used slurs to described the area and called the residents "debased" and "wretched", there is reason to doubt the impartiality of those calling it a "shantytown".
- libraryatnight 6y agoOk, protecting rich neighborhoods still sounds like keeping out undesirables. https://www.cnn.com/2020/08/01/us/white-liberals-hypocrisy-race-blake/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2020/08/01/us/white-liberals-hypocrisy-r...
- whatshisface 6y agoPoor white people are the difference between "protecting rich neighborhoods" and "protecting racial homogeneity." I don't know of any time that poor white people have ever been included in the rich people enclaves, which takes some of the air out of the race-and-race-alone perspective.
- ashtonkem 6y agoI mean, there were literally neighborhoods that were legally marked as “whites only”. That seems like a pretty important detail. You need to also include racist bank and financial policies in order to get the whole picture. While poor whites are indeed excluded from rich neighborhoods, they’re also been the recipients of federal welfare designed to make them rich enough for “respectable” neighborhoods; blacks have not received the same treatment. See: racial disparities in how GI bill worked. https://www.history.com/news/gi-bill-black-wwii-veterans-benefits https://www.history.com/news/gi-bill-black-wwii-veterans-ben...
- jokethrowaway 6y agoSegregation was outlawed in the 60s. Black Americans were on an upward trajectory until the 60s despite living in a society with systemic racism. That was until the government decided to pay cash to destroy family structure. Welfare actually could have played a different role you from what you may imagine: https://ifstudies.org/blog/family-breakdown-and-americas-welfare-system#welfare-may-have-played-a-role https://ifstudies.org/blog/family-breakdown-and-americas-wel...
- libraryatnight 6y agoI'm not arguing race alone, but the comment seemed completely dismissive to the notion that keeping out the poor also usually means keeping out minorities. So yes, there's poor white people. https://medium.com/equality-includes-you/explaining-white-privilege-to-a-broke-white-person-2239d9d2470b https://medium.com/equality-includes-you/explaining-white-pr...
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- bernawil 6y agoWell, it's code for "keep density low" and "keep traffic out of my property while I go generate traffic on other people's property". The results are the same though.
- jbay808 6y agoProperty values often increase from increasing density (ie, replacing my five-million-dollar mansion with a twenty-million-dollar apartment building on the same lot). The zoning doesn't necessarily protect property values as such, so it's an important distinction.