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> completely inaccessible to the mobility-disabled? One of my favorite coffee shops is a little hole in the wall in the basement or an old brick building. Des
by war1025 6y ago
> completely inaccessible to the mobility-disabled?
One of my favorite coffee shops is a little hole in the wall in the basement or an old brick building.
Despite the fact that to get to the shop, you need to go down a narrow set of exterior stairs, the owner was required to put in a wheel-chair accessible bathroom. It's a small space and the bathroom is nearly as big as the seating area.
It's an asinine requirement.
The owner looked into moving to a different spot a block away, which would have been on the main level. He backed out of that when the city told him he needed to install a grease trap to meet code. This despite the fact that nothing he sold contained any sort of grease or oil that would make it down the drain.
Zoning laws and HOAs are great in concept. But they tend to get taken over by the Delores Umbridge [1] types who love nothing more than punishing people for violating stupid rules.
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dolores_Umbridge https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dolores_Umbridge
- djur 6y agoZoning laws and HOAs really aren't great in concept, but they're also not the same thing as disabled access laws and environmental regulations.
- war1025 6y agoAlright, well lump them all together. There are ways for laws and regulations to be thoughtfully applied, and there are ways for them to be abused by people who enjoy causing other people pain. When the regulatory burden is so heavy that only people who have already "made it" can even play, then government has gone too far.
- jmccaf 6y agoSan Jose, CA had a streak of ADA torts that resulted in small businesses closing shop : https://sanjosespotlight.com/access-v-abuse-crema-coffee-in-san-jose-closes-due-to-ada-lawsuit/ https://sanjosespotlight.com/access-v-abuse-crema-coffee-in-... https://www.ktvu.com/news/times-up-san-jose-deli-closing-its-doors-after-nearly-70-years https://www.ktvu.com/news/times-up-san-jose-deli-closing-its...
- ac29 6y agoFYI, Crema moved a few blocks away and is still open.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- kube-system 6y agoIs it the requirement that is asinine, or the fact that the ADA allows grandfathered exceptions for parts of buildings that are unrenovated? I'm not sure what possibly could make more sense and be more fair than "if you change it, the changes you meet have to be up to current law" Would it make more sense if we made people raze their entire pre-ADA buildings to renovate anything at all? > He backed out of that when the city told him he needed to install a grease trap to meet code. This despite the fact that nothing he sold contained any sort of grease or oil that would make it down the drain. Also, building codes aren't necessarily for the way you plan to use a building, but for the way a building can be used.
- gowld 6y ago> or the way a building can be used. "can be" means "isn't"
- kube-system 6y agoRegulations have to be applied to some measurable standard to be effective. Exceptions based on unmeasurable promises basically guarantee a toothless regulation.
- extra88 6y agoA bathroom stall big enough for a wheelchair is also big enough for someone who can manage the stairs but needs assistance with the toilet. Regulatory requirements can have justifications beyond the most apparent one.
- war1025 6y ago> A bathroom stall big enough for a wheelchair is also big enough for someone who can manage the stairs but needs assistance with the toilet. And as someone with young children, I think it's a great bathroom. But the truth is it could easily be half the size that it is and still be a perfectly nice bathroom.
- anm89 6y agosure, and as someone who values inclusion all thing equal. I'm not interested in spending 70k+ to cater to either. It just doesn't make sense for this structure.