4 ms·

Wind turbines are painted white to reduce their visibility (particularly effective on overcast days). Humans don't want to see wind turbines, birds do. I wonder

Wind turbines are painted white to reduce their visibility (particularly effective on overcast days). Humans don't want to see wind turbines, birds do. I wonder wether the turbines can be painted a color which blends in with the natural scenery for humans but is really visible for birds.

OldHand2018 6y ago
> For this study, we maximized the contrast by applying black paint. What remains to be tested is whether other color regimes will be equally effective, for example, red stripes as used for aviation warning purposes, green paint to reduce visibility (to humans) in the landscape or optical or holographic coatings. In the experiments by Hodos (2003), yellow and red, but especially green blades had slight—but nonsignificant—visibility advantages over black; which was therefore suggested be simplest and most effective to implement. It looks like they are hoping for the change to test other options, now that this first study shows promise.
Analemma_ 6y ago
Can't birds see into the ultraviolet part of the spectrum? I wonder if you could get the blades to emit enough UV light for them to avoid it.
- barbegal 6y ago
  If anything the black works because it absorbs UV (and visible) light.
- Someone 6y ago
  You would have to check whether emitting UV light attracts insects. If they do, chances are the insects would attract insect-eating birds, and death rate could go up, even if the birds can see the blades better.
ornornor 6y ago
Don’t birds see UV? Won’t that show as black for those who see it, and transparent for those who don’t? If so, putting sunscreen on the blades would work.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
dec0dedab0de 6y ago
Who doesn't want to see turbines? They're so neat. And even if they're white you can clearly see them unless you have trouble seeing. A few times a year, my son and I drive past a wind farm and make references to this xkcd https://xkcd.com/1378/ https://xkcd.com/1378/ I admit I might be weird though, I routinely wish that the pipes and wires were on the outside of the drywall, and I took the doors off my pantry so I can see everything.
- raziel2p 6y ago
  I'm sure you don't mind when you're just driving on the freeway, but wind turbines are also being installed in places where there's a lot of natural beauty, for example https://www.fortum.com/about-us/our-company/our-energy-production/our-power-plants/nygardsfjellet https://www.fortum.com/about-us/our-company/our-energy-produ... (flattering picture, you can probably find much worse examples)
  - saalweachter 6y ago
    The tricky part is that it depends on the human. For instance, I don't find natural forests or mountains more beautiful than well maintained cropland or pastures or gardens; they are just different kinds of beautiful. (Since I grew up on a farm, I call this "the farmer aesthetic".) I also don't think I would find well-maintained, visible -- even colorful! -- wind turbines to detract from a scene of natural beauty; it would just be a different scene than it was before, not inherently worse for that difference. But I acknowledge this is not a universally-held aesthetic.
    - velox_io 6y ago
      A lot of buildings used in rural areas definitely aren't aesthetic pleasing, massive industrial buildings where the primary concern is build cost. They provide jobs to the region so people treat it as a necessary evil. People need jobs but power just comes out of the wall... Then can generate it elsewhere (not in my back yard), that's what I believe the primary issue is. Wind turbines also work better on hill and where the surrounding area isn't obstructed, so by definition they're a little tricky to hide. What I've always found odd is how windmills are loved and wind turbines are hated. Maybe tell people they're windmills? But in all seriousness, power generation is something that isn't discussed as much as it needs to be. Electric vehicles are coming fast (fuel prices are surprisingly low right now, but it never stays that way..) and when you consider the number of vehicles about, that will take quite a bit of power (or Angry Pixies as a certain Youtuber would say). Energy does have a cost to the environment (there isn't an easyway around that), but it also has a cost to the economy, there's no simple answer which is why I think it isn't discussed enough. I'm pro nuclear, on a renewable energy tariff and I'd argue natural gas makes a lot of sense in the UK - That's just my answer.

OldHand2018 6y ago

> For this study, we maximized the contrast by applying black paint. What remains to be tested is whether other color regimes will be equally effective, for example, red stripes as used for aviation warning purposes, green paint to reduce visibility (to humans) in the landscape or optical or holographic coatings. In the experiments by Hodos (2003), yellow and red, but especially green blades had slight—but nonsignificant—visibility advantages over black; which was therefore suggested be simplest and most effective to implement. It looks like they are hoping for the change to test other options, now that this first study shows promise.

Analemma_ 6y ago

Can't birds see into the ultraviolet part of the spectrum? I wonder if you could get the blades to emit enough UV light for them to avoid it.

barbegal 6y ago
If anything the black works because it absorbs UV (and visible) light.
Someone 6y ago
You would have to check whether emitting UV light attracts insects. If they do, chances are the insects would attract insect-eating birds, and death rate could go up, even if the birds can see the blades better.

ornornor 6y ago

Don’t birds see UV? Won’t that show as black for those who see it, and transparent for those who don’t? If so, putting sunscreen on the blades would work.

deleted 6y ago
[deleted]

dec0dedab0de 6y ago

Who doesn't want to see turbines? They're so neat. And even if they're white you can clearly see them unless you have trouble seeing. A few times a year, my son and I drive past a wind farm and make references to this xkcd https://xkcd.com/1378/ https://xkcd.com/1378/ I admit I might be weird though, I routinely wish that the pipes and wires were on the outside of the drywall, and I took the doors off my pantry so I can see everything.

raziel2p 6y ago
I'm sure you don't mind when you're just driving on the freeway, but wind turbines are also being installed in places where there's a lot of natural beauty, for example https://www.fortum.com/about-us/our-company/our-energy-production/our-power-plants/nygardsfjellet https://www.fortum.com/about-us/our-company/our-energy-produ... (flattering picture, you can probably find much worse examples)
- saalweachter 6y ago
  The tricky part is that it depends on the human. For instance, I don't find natural forests or mountains more beautiful than well maintained cropland or pastures or gardens; they are just different kinds of beautiful. (Since I grew up on a farm, I call this "the farmer aesthetic".) I also don't think I would find well-maintained, visible -- even colorful! -- wind turbines to detract from a scene of natural beauty; it would just be a different scene than it was before, not inherently worse for that difference. But I acknowledge this is not a universally-held aesthetic.
  - velox_io 6y ago
    A lot of buildings used in rural areas definitely aren't aesthetic pleasing, massive industrial buildings where the primary concern is build cost. They provide jobs to the region so people treat it as a necessary evil. People need jobs but power just comes out of the wall... Then can generate it elsewhere (not in my back yard), that's what I believe the primary issue is. Wind turbines also work better on hill and where the surrounding area isn't obstructed, so by definition they're a little tricky to hide. What I've always found odd is how windmills are loved and wind turbines are hated. Maybe tell people they're windmills? But in all seriousness, power generation is something that isn't discussed as much as it needs to be. Electric vehicles are coming fast (fuel prices are surprisingly low right now, but it never stays that way..) and when you consider the number of vehicles about, that will take quite a bit of power (or Angry Pixies as a certain Youtuber would say). Energy does have a cost to the environment (there isn't an easyway around that), but it also has a cost to the economy, there's no simple answer which is why I think it isn't discussed enough. I'm pro nuclear, on a renewable energy tariff and I'd argue natural gas makes a lot of sense in the UK - That's just my answer.