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For an ID to be used for voting in most states it has to have the following info Name Address Photo And critically an EXPIRATION DATE Texas Handgun licenses h

by syshum 6y ago

For an ID to be used for voting in most states it has to have the following info Name Address Photo And critically an EXPIRATION DATE Texas Handgun licenses has all 4, University ID's and Employee ID's lack an expiration date thus are not elibible as a valid form of ID That is not Voter Suppression Further if you happen to not have one of the 7 Accepted forms of ID (which is unlikely given all the different circumstances that a person needs to have one of these to get a job, open a bank account, fly on a plane, rent an apartment or 1000's of other thing that you need an ID for) the State of Texas Also allows you to fill out a declaration of why you do not have said ID, and use a Utility Bill, Bank Statement, Government Check, PayCheck or Birth Certificate to vote. [1] This hardly sounds like an unreasonable burden to vote [1]https://www.sos.state.tx.us/elections/forms/id/poster-11x17-aw-voter.pdf https://www.sos.state.tx.us/elections/forms/id/poster-11x17-...

esarbe 6y ago
It is voter suppression if it makes voting significantly harder for certain subsets of the population. Voter id laws tend to disenfranchise poor people.
- syshum 6y ago
  This always seems like a Red Herring. In what way does is "disenfranchise poor people", the ID's are Free, most states the locations to obtain said ID are widely distributed and no harder to get to than a grocery store or any other store, and in the event there is an actual reason one could not get one then there are alternatives to the official ID that can be used Seems to me the only disenfranchisement is people that can not legally vote in the first place
  - esarbe 6y ago
    Just by the pure fact that you have to invest time and effort to get the necessary documentation, voter ID laws introduce another barrier that will disproportionately affect poor people that might not have the option of just not going to work for half a day to clear the necessary bureaucratic hurdles. If you want voter IDs; that's fine. And if you can really just walk to any grocery and get a voter ID, that's fine too. But let's take Iowa's planned voter ID law of 2007 as an example; this requires a drivers license or a passport or a US birth certificate. If you don't have such documentation (and surprise; poor people are more often lacking such documentation) then you have to invest time and effort. You seem to think that voter impersonation seems to be a problem. It has been shown that this is not the case[0]. So, what problem exactly are voter IDs supposed to solve? [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voter_impersonation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voter_impersonation
    - syshum 6y ago
      >> you have to invest time and effort to get the necessary documentation you have to invest time and energy into everything in life (including voting itself), this is not a valid argument at all in my opinion. If you can not invest the very small amount of time and energy needed to get an ID, then you certainly are not investing the time and energy to research and understand the people you are voting for and/or the initiatives that appear on the ballot >But let's take Iowa's planned voter ID law of 2007 I am not sure what the "planned" law in 2007 was, nor do I really care what is was since you use the terminology of "planned" I assume it did not actually pass. Looking at the actual law of Iowa[1] any voter that does not have a Drivers License is automatically mailed a voter ID card when they Register to vote, and Iowa also allows for Election Day Registration for which you can use an Existing ID or Proof of Residency [2] such as Residential lease, Utility bill (including a cell phone bill), Bank statement, Paycheck, Government check or other government document So again I do not find this law, that is actually on the books to be burdensome Can you point to an Actual law, on the books today and activity enforced, that has the burdens you claim to be sure deterrents to raise to the level of suppression or are you just reading too many NYTimes stories about the evils of Voter ID to actually research the topic yourself? >>You seem to think that voter impersonation seems to be a problem Point to any statement I have made that says or even implies that? Every other interaction I have with the government requires ID I fail to see why Voting should be exempt from this requirement. [1] https://sos.iowa.gov/elections/voterinformation/voterIDfaq.html https://sos.iowa.gov/elections/voterinformation/voterIDfaq.h... [2] https://sos.iowa.gov/elections/voterinformation/edr.html https://sos.iowa.gov/elections/voterinformation/edr.html
      - esarbe 6y ago
        > So again I do not find this law, that is actually on the books to be burdensome You might consider yourself privileged, then. Because there is extensive research about the costs that are associated with voter id laws[0]. > or are you just reading too many NYTimes stories about the evils of Voter ID NYT is fine, although not my favorite. I prefer The Intercept. > Point to any statement I have made that says or even implies that? It was my impression, that's why I wrote "You seem" instead of "You say [...]" or "You write [...]". So; what is the problem do you want to solve with voter ids? [0] https://today.law.harvard.edu/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/FullReportVoterIDJune20141.pdf https://today.law.harvard.edu/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/Ful...

by syshum 6y ago

esarbe 6y ago

It is voter suppression if it makes voting significantly harder for certain subsets of the population. Voter id laws tend to disenfranchise poor people.

syshum 6y ago
This always seems like a Red Herring. In what way does is "disenfranchise poor people", the ID's are Free, most states the locations to obtain said ID are widely distributed and no harder to get to than a grocery store or any other store, and in the event there is an actual reason one could not get one then there are alternatives to the official ID that can be used Seems to me the only disenfranchisement is people that can not legally vote in the first place
- esarbe 6y ago
  Just by the pure fact that you have to invest time and effort to get the necessary documentation, voter ID laws introduce another barrier that will disproportionately affect poor people that might not have the option of just not going to work for half a day to clear the necessary bureaucratic hurdles. If you want voter IDs; that's fine. And if you can really just walk to any grocery and get a voter ID, that's fine too. But let's take Iowa's planned voter ID law of 2007 as an example; this requires a drivers license or a passport or a US birth certificate. If you don't have such documentation (and surprise; poor people are more often lacking such documentation) then you have to invest time and effort. You seem to think that voter impersonation seems to be a problem. It has been shown that this is not the case[0]. So, what problem exactly are voter IDs supposed to solve? [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voter_impersonation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voter_impersonation
  - syshum 6y ago
    >> you have to invest time and effort to get the necessary documentation you have to invest time and energy into everything in life (including voting itself), this is not a valid argument at all in my opinion. If you can not invest the very small amount of time and energy needed to get an ID, then you certainly are not investing the time and energy to research and understand the people you are voting for and/or the initiatives that appear on the ballot >But let's take Iowa's planned voter ID law of 2007 I am not sure what the "planned" law in 2007 was, nor do I really care what is was since you use the terminology of "planned" I assume it did not actually pass. Looking at the actual law of Iowa[1] any voter that does not have a Drivers License is automatically mailed a voter ID card when they Register to vote, and Iowa also allows for Election Day Registration for which you can use an Existing ID or Proof of Residency [2] such as Residential lease, Utility bill (including a cell phone bill), Bank statement, Paycheck, Government check or other government document So again I do not find this law, that is actually on the books to be burdensome Can you point to an Actual law, on the books today and activity enforced, that has the burdens you claim to be sure deterrents to raise to the level of suppression or are you just reading too many NYTimes stories about the evils of Voter ID to actually research the topic yourself? >>You seem to think that voter impersonation seems to be a problem Point to any statement I have made that says or even implies that? Every other interaction I have with the government requires ID I fail to see why Voting should be exempt from this requirement. [1] https://sos.iowa.gov/elections/voterinformation/voterIDfaq.html https://sos.iowa.gov/elections/voterinformation/voterIDfaq.h... [2] https://sos.iowa.gov/elections/voterinformation/edr.html https://sos.iowa.gov/elections/voterinformation/edr.html
    - esarbe 6y ago
      > So again I do not find this law, that is actually on the books to be burdensome You might consider yourself privileged, then. Because there is extensive research about the costs that are associated with voter id laws[0]. > or are you just reading too many NYTimes stories about the evils of Voter ID NYT is fine, although not my favorite. I prefer The Intercept. > Point to any statement I have made that says or even implies that? It was my impression, that's why I wrote "You seem" instead of "You say [...]" or "You write [...]". So; what is the problem do you want to solve with voter ids? [0] https://today.law.harvard.edu/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/FullReportVoterIDJune20141.pdf https://today.law.harvard.edu/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/Ful...