4 ms·

> I feel that many people would be satisfied if Firefox was just a small(ish) browser catering to power users. There's no way to do that in today's environment

> I feel that many people would be satisfied if Firefox was just a small(ish) browser catering to power users. There's no way to do that in today's environment. Browser development is extremely expensive (there's only 3 companies in the world developing competitive browser engines) so you need money. For Firefox, the only way to get serious cash is to have serious marketshare. And in reality there isn't that many "power users". I mean, even a lot of developers (like me) use barely any extensions and in any case prefer more speed than more extensibility.

slightwinder 6y ago
Browser development is not that expensive. Developing of Web-Engines is the dark part that sucks all the money. > For Firefox, the only way to get serious cash is to have serious marketshare. Not true. That's only valid if your single income is marketshare-based. Mozilla for some unknown reasons hasn't made any serious attempts in the last 15+ years to get any alternative income, instead it was satisfied with being feeding on google and yahoo, while wasting money on some obvious dead projects.
- The_Colonel 6y ago
  > Browser development is not that expensive. Developing of Web-Engines is the dark part that sucks all the money. Of course, but then there's enough Chromium skins, no? Without independent browser engine you have no clout in defining and ratifying standard (as MS recently found out) which means giving Google full control. > Mozilla for some unknown reasons hasn't made any serious attempts in the last 15+ years to get any alternative income, instead it was satisfied with being feeding on google and yahoo, while wasting money on some obvious dead projects. They had some feeble attempts which largely failed. Mozilla's main expertise is still browser technology based and it is probably difficult to monetize it.
  - slightwinder 6y ago
    > Of course, but then there's enough Chromium skins, no? Most of them are more than skins. A browser is the interface and whole workflow, not just the way the website is displayed. > as MS recently found out What do you mean? > They had some feeble attempts which largely failed. They had no SERIOUS attempt. Well until now at least. They did some half-assed with pocket and now VPN-reselling, but never touched real business.
    - The_Colonel 6y ago
      > Most of them are more than skins. A browser is the interface and whole workflow, not just the way the website is displayed. The user interface is just minor part of the browser. Mozilla's mission is to "free the web". Something like that can't be done with slightly sleeker UI on top of monopolistic rendering engine. You need to have an influence on all levels. > as MS recently found out I've read it this week in some interview with the FF developers that ever since MS gave up on homegrown Edge engine and adopted Chromium/Blink their voice on the standards committee is weak and lacks clout. No wonder. It's google who keeps strict control over chromium/blink. MS can discuss, propose, even send PRs, but it's google who will decide what gets in and what doesn't. > They had no SERIOUS attempt. Well until now at least. They did some half-assed with pocket and now VPN-reselling, but never touched real business. Well yeah. But it just sounds a bit simplistic to say "just earn that $500 million profits somewhere so you can sponsor your side project Firefox".
      - slightwinder 6y ago
        > Mozilla's mission is to "free the web". Something like that can't be done with slightly sleeker UI on top of monopolistic rendering engine. You need to have an influence on all levels. That depends on behaviour. > I've read it this week in some interview with the FF developers that ever since MS gave up on homegrown Edge engine and adopted Chromium/Blink their voice on the standards committee is weak and lacks clout. As if they had much to say before... But that's the point, your influence depends on what you do and who is backing you. Chrome-Edge is just too small and Microsoft is not doing much to build their influence at the moment. > Well yeah. But it just sounds a bit simplistic to say "just earn that $500 million profits somewhere so you can sponsor your side project Firefox". If you have a budget of some hundred million dollars and a very big and enthuastic community, then it's very easy to make money. Even having enough money at all can make you money, though this might be ruled out for Mozilla because of their legal status.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]

slightwinder 6y ago

Browser development is not that expensive. Developing of Web-Engines is the dark part that sucks all the money. > For Firefox, the only way to get serious cash is to have serious marketshare. Not true. That's only valid if your single income is marketshare-based. Mozilla for some unknown reasons hasn't made any serious attempts in the last 15+ years to get any alternative income, instead it was satisfied with being feeding on google and yahoo, while wasting money on some obvious dead projects.

The_Colonel 6y ago
> Browser development is not that expensive. Developing of Web-Engines is the dark part that sucks all the money. Of course, but then there's enough Chromium skins, no? Without independent browser engine you have no clout in defining and ratifying standard (as MS recently found out) which means giving Google full control. > Mozilla for some unknown reasons hasn't made any serious attempts in the last 15+ years to get any alternative income, instead it was satisfied with being feeding on google and yahoo, while wasting money on some obvious dead projects. They had some feeble attempts which largely failed. Mozilla's main expertise is still browser technology based and it is probably difficult to monetize it.
- slightwinder 6y ago
  > Of course, but then there's enough Chromium skins, no? Most of them are more than skins. A browser is the interface and whole workflow, not just the way the website is displayed. > as MS recently found out What do you mean? > They had some feeble attempts which largely failed. They had no SERIOUS attempt. Well until now at least. They did some half-assed with pocket and now VPN-reselling, but never touched real business.
  - The_Colonel 6y ago
    > Most of them are more than skins. A browser is the interface and whole workflow, not just the way the website is displayed. The user interface is just minor part of the browser. Mozilla's mission is to "free the web". Something like that can't be done with slightly sleeker UI on top of monopolistic rendering engine. You need to have an influence on all levels. > as MS recently found out I've read it this week in some interview with the FF developers that ever since MS gave up on homegrown Edge engine and adopted Chromium/Blink their voice on the standards committee is weak and lacks clout. No wonder. It's google who keeps strict control over chromium/blink. MS can discuss, propose, even send PRs, but it's google who will decide what gets in and what doesn't. > They had no SERIOUS attempt. Well until now at least. They did some half-assed with pocket and now VPN-reselling, but never touched real business. Well yeah. But it just sounds a bit simplistic to say "just earn that $500 million profits somewhere so you can sponsor your side project Firefox".
    - slightwinder 6y ago
      > Mozilla's mission is to "free the web". Something like that can't be done with slightly sleeker UI on top of monopolistic rendering engine. You need to have an influence on all levels. That depends on behaviour. > I've read it this week in some interview with the FF developers that ever since MS gave up on homegrown Edge engine and adopted Chromium/Blink their voice on the standards committee is weak and lacks clout. As if they had much to say before... But that's the point, your influence depends on what you do and who is backing you. Chrome-Edge is just too small and Microsoft is not doing much to build their influence at the moment. > Well yeah. But it just sounds a bit simplistic to say "just earn that $500 million profits somewhere so you can sponsor your side project Firefox". If you have a budget of some hundred million dollars and a very big and enthuastic community, then it's very easy to make money. Even having enough money at all can make you money, though this might be ruled out for Mozilla because of their legal status.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]