7 ms·

Azure as well https://github.com/Azure/azure-service-operator https://github.com/Azure/azure-service-operator

FridgeSeal 6y ago
Bold of you to assume that: * the magic permissions ghost that runs in Azure whose job it is to inexplicably deny you resources to things won’t interfere * Said Azure service will stay up long enough to be useful * you finish writing the insane amount of config Azure services seemingly require before the heat death of the universe. * Azure decides that it likes you and won’t arbitrarily block you from attaching things to your cluster/nodes because it’s the wrong moon cycle/day of the week/device type/etc * you can somehow navigate Azures kafka-esque documentation got figure out which services you’re actually allowed to do this with. It is only a slight exaggeration to say that Azure is the most painful and frustrating software/cloud product I’ve used in a long time, probably ever, and I earnestly look forward to having literally any excuse to migrate off it.
- zxienin 6y ago
  > and I earnestly look forward to having literally any excuse to migrate off it Azure’s enterprise sales machine will make sure your wait is long. They sell bulk block deals to CIO, not to devs directly.
- ithkuil 6y ago
  Give it time, it will get better. When I was forced to use it in 2010 it was horrible; now ten years later is definitely better. In 2030 it will rock!
  - FridgeSeal 6y ago
    That's like, a full 10 years I could spend not putting up with it though. > In 2030 it will rock! Apart from _maybe_ VSCode, what has MS made that makes you go "this rocks"?
    - hestefisk 6y ago
      WSL, .Net Core?
      - FridgeSeal 6y ago
        I'm ambivalent about .net as a whole, but I'll pay that one.
    - GordonS 6y ago
      Azure DevOps, dotnet core, WSL/WSL2, SQL Server on Linux, Typescript, Powershell Core (OK, so I honestly don't like Powershell, but many do), Visual Studio (I prefer Rider, but VS is great great), Windows 10 (yes, I love it), Azure DevOps (yes, I love it, unless I have to work with one of the poorly documented services), Xbox One...
      - FridgeSeal 6y ago
        Fascinating. Fair play, I'm either ambivalent or not a fan of most of those - except maybe the Xbox, I have a PS4, but the X1 is pretty nice. > Azure DevOps...one of the poorly documented services So like, all of them? Hahahaha > SQL Server on Linux Next to Azure, this is the next biggest cause of issues at work for me, and I haven't seen any wild advantage of this over Postgres, with the disadvantage that pretty much every linux/macOS and open source tool I use is much happier to plug in to Postgres instead.
        GordonS 6y ago
        > So like, all of them? Hahahaha I really think that's unfair, untrue even. I work with a lot of services on a regular basis, and while it very frustrating to find something with missing documentation, it seems to be confined to certain services, and mostly then for new'ish features. In those cases, they are quite responsive on GitHub. > Next to Azure, this is the next biggest cause of issues at work for me, and I haven't seen any wild advantage of this over Postgres, with the disadvantage that pretty much every linux/macOS and open source tool I use is much happier to plug in to Postgres instead. I also personally prefer Postgres, and by a margin. But I have also worked with SQL Server on Linux, and haven't found any differences over SQL Server on Windows - it just works.
- lifty 6y ago
  I have to agree with you, I find it painful to work with Azure.
- xiwenc 6y ago
  I’m feel your pain also my friend. Azure quality is terrible compared to competitors: * no good working examples in docs * docs hard to read * docs are not consistent with reality * the web portal UX is inconsistent and outright weird (when you navigate through resource group, you can scroll back horizontally to previous context/screen; what a joke) * there are a gazillion preview api versions that never gets released officially. * and if you’re lucky to work with azure devops, it’s like building a house of cards with different card types and sizes I’ve worked with AWS and GCP in the past. Indeed Azure is often chosen by CIO’s rather than people that have to work with the service every day.
  - FridgeSeal 6y ago
    Oh my god the web UX, how did I forget about that: for the life of me I cannot figure out why they make all the interfaces scroll sideways. Why? Who does that? Docs being hard to read and inconsistent with reality is a big point. My favourite mismatch is the storage classes one: it turns out there's actually 2 different grades of SSD available, but their examples and docs only mention premium SSD's. I only discovered "normal" SSD because they happen to auto-create a storage class with them in your Kubernetes cluster. The adventure to figure out whether you can attach a premium SSD to an instance is a whole new ball game - trying to find which instances _actually_ allow you to attach them is like looking for a needle in a haystack. Why are they so difficult about it? AWS is like "you want an EBS volume of type io1? There you go, done". Azure: "oh no, you _can't_ have premium ssd. Because reasons".
    - arethuza 6y ago
      I thought the sideways scrolling (which was pretty weird) was only on the "old" Azure Portal - I'm not aware of it bothering me on the current Portal.
    - ahoka 6y ago
      Actually there are three kind of SSD storage types in Azure: Standard, Premium and Ultra. I’m assuming that you need to provision an ‘s’ VM because the regular instances lack the connectivity for the faster storage, but that’s just guessing.

Bold of you to assume that: * the magic permissions ghost that runs in Azure whose job it is to inexplicably deny you resources to things won’t interfere * Said Azure service will stay up long enough to be useful * you finish writing the insane amount of config Azure services seemingly require before the heat death of the universe. * Azure decides that it likes you and won’t arbitrarily block you from attaching things to your cluster/nodes because it’s the wrong moon cycle/day of the week/device type/etc * you can somehow navigate Azures kafka-esque documentation got figure out which services you’re actually allowed to do this with. It is only a slight exaggeration to say that Azure is the most painful and frustrating software/cloud product I’ve used in a long time, probably ever, and I earnestly look forward to having literally any excuse to migrate off it.

zxienin 6y ago
> and I earnestly look forward to having literally any excuse to migrate off it Azure’s enterprise sales machine will make sure your wait is long. They sell bulk block deals to CIO, not to devs directly.
ithkuil 6y ago
Give it time, it will get better. When I was forced to use it in 2010 it was horrible; now ten years later is definitely better. In 2030 it will rock!
- FridgeSeal 6y ago
  That's like, a full 10 years I could spend not putting up with it though. > In 2030 it will rock! Apart from _maybe_ VSCode, what has MS made that makes you go "this rocks"?
  - hestefisk 6y ago
    WSL, .Net Core?
    - FridgeSeal 6y ago
      I'm ambivalent about .net as a whole, but I'll pay that one.
  - GordonS 6y ago
    Azure DevOps, dotnet core, WSL/WSL2, SQL Server on Linux, Typescript, Powershell Core (OK, so I honestly don't like Powershell, but many do), Visual Studio (I prefer Rider, but VS is great great), Windows 10 (yes, I love it), Azure DevOps (yes, I love it, unless I have to work with one of the poorly documented services), Xbox One...
    - FridgeSeal 6y ago
      Fascinating. Fair play, I'm either ambivalent or not a fan of most of those - except maybe the Xbox, I have a PS4, but the X1 is pretty nice. > Azure DevOps...one of the poorly documented services So like, all of them? Hahahaha > SQL Server on Linux Next to Azure, this is the next biggest cause of issues at work for me, and I haven't seen any wild advantage of this over Postgres, with the disadvantage that pretty much every linux/macOS and open source tool I use is much happier to plug in to Postgres instead.
      - GordonS 6y ago
        > So like, all of them? Hahahaha I really think that's unfair, untrue even. I work with a lot of services on a regular basis, and while it very frustrating to find something with missing documentation, it seems to be confined to certain services, and mostly then for new'ish features. In those cases, they are quite responsive on GitHub. > Next to Azure, this is the next biggest cause of issues at work for me, and I haven't seen any wild advantage of this over Postgres, with the disadvantage that pretty much every linux/macOS and open source tool I use is much happier to plug in to Postgres instead. I also personally prefer Postgres, and by a margin. But I have also worked with SQL Server on Linux, and haven't found any differences over SQL Server on Windows - it just works.
lifty 6y ago
I have to agree with you, I find it painful to work with Azure.
xiwenc 6y ago
I’m feel your pain also my friend. Azure quality is terrible compared to competitors: * no good working examples in docs * docs hard to read * docs are not consistent with reality * the web portal UX is inconsistent and outright weird (when you navigate through resource group, you can scroll back horizontally to previous context/screen; what a joke) * there are a gazillion preview api versions that never gets released officially. * and if you’re lucky to work with azure devops, it’s like building a house of cards with different card types and sizes I’ve worked with AWS and GCP in the past. Indeed Azure is often chosen by CIO’s rather than people that have to work with the service every day.
- FridgeSeal 6y ago
  Oh my god the web UX, how did I forget about that: for the life of me I cannot figure out why they make all the interfaces scroll sideways. Why? Who does that? Docs being hard to read and inconsistent with reality is a big point. My favourite mismatch is the storage classes one: it turns out there's actually 2 different grades of SSD available, but their examples and docs only mention premium SSD's. I only discovered "normal" SSD because they happen to auto-create a storage class with them in your Kubernetes cluster. The adventure to figure out whether you can attach a premium SSD to an instance is a whole new ball game - trying to find which instances _actually_ allow you to attach them is like looking for a needle in a haystack. Why are they so difficult about it? AWS is like "you want an EBS volume of type io1? There you go, done". Azure: "oh no, you _can't_ have premium ssd. Because reasons".
  - arethuza 6y ago
    I thought the sideways scrolling (which was pretty weird) was only on the "old" Azure Portal - I'm not aware of it bothering me on the current Portal.
  - ahoka 6y ago
    Actually there are three kind of SSD storage types in Azure: Standard, Premium and Ultra. I’m assuming that you need to provision an ‘s’ VM because the regular instances lack the connectivity for the faster storage, but that’s just guessing.