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Billionaires are good for society. elon musk and jeff bezos are leading the way into space and that is huge for humanity. If you tax them you will literally sto

Billionaires are good for society. elon musk and jeff bezos are leading the way into space and that is huge for humanity. If you tax them you will literally stop humanity from becoming multi-planetary. The comparison to aristocracy is absurd. The US was founded abolishing the class system because the wanted equal opportunity, not equal outcome.

zentiggr 6y ago
And in the ensuing time, those with money and influence built up the class distinctions in the legal and tax codes. The comparison isn't an exact match, but the class distinction IS. Bezos may be contributing to the privatization of space, but he's doing it by exploiting the ones who keep the merchandise flowing through the cash cow. 19th century robber barons honed some of that machinery, Amazon has capitalized on and honed to a fine sharpness that blade.
big_youth 6y ago
>Billionaires are good for society. elon musk and jeff bezos are leading the way into space and that is huge for humanity. Enough with the blanket statements, Sure bill gates is ok but just yesterday the front page had a story of the Sackler family and how they amassed billions by pumping the united states with opiates. They literally killed thousands and ruined the lives of millions, while destroying American society. Billionaries are people, some evil some good. Also, the point of a government is to provide for it's citizens (with taxes) not to hope that in a 100years we can settle on other planets. And btw, in that scenario we would not be the ones who end up on Elysium. As much as SV programmers like to think they can be part the billionaire class you are not and will never be an oligarch.
- mgkimsal 6y ago
  going further, if sackler family started funding space exploration.... are they now good?
  - chasd00 6y ago
    For the people who worship at the feet of Bill Gates the answer is definitely yes.
- oblio 6y ago
  Gates delayed the progress of the internet by about 5 years, intentionally. I know he's doing a lot of good lately, but let's also not forget the bad. Who knows how many other good things he's delayed indirectly because he delayed the internet so much?
  - zepto 6y ago
    If not implementing things that later become important is immoral, we are all guilty. You could just as easily say that Gates advanced the progress of the internet by driving the price of PCs down so that more people owned them. It’s also reasonable to say that these decisions were a major reason why Microsoft lost their dominant position. Gates is rich, but he lost his power over the software industry over this.
- kuzimoto 6y ago
  > the point of a government is to provide for it's citizens (with taxes) Isn't this a sort of oxymoron? The taxes come from other citizens. The ones who are paying a majority of the taxes are not provided for by the government. Government should seek to provide everyone equal protection of their rights.
- zepto 6y ago
  I thought it was Doctors who pumped the United States full of opiates. I also thought the demand was a result of political policies that didn’t provide support for communities who were impoverished by the globalization of manufacturing and other industries. Yes, the Sackler’s profited, and were irredeemably bad actors in this, but they are just one part of the story.
- achenatx 6y ago
  Drugs should be legal and people should be allowed to buy and sell them. I would rather have the sackler family than the drug cartels. You believe the point of govt is to provide for its citizens, that doesnt make it a fact. Others believe the point of government is to protect us from each other while letting us make personal choices for good or ill.
- wuliwong 6y ago
  > the point of a government is to provide for it's citizens (with taxes) I this this is objectively incorrect for the USA.
monooso 6y ago
> Billionaires are good for society. elon musk and jeff bezos are leading the way into space and that is huge for humanity. If you tax them you will literally stop humanity from becoming multi-planetary. This argument really doesn't hold water. For a start it implies that becoming a multi-planet species would be impossible without Musk or Bezos holding vast personal wealth. There is no reason to believe that.[1] It also implies that Bezos couldn't possibly fund Blue Origin if he was worth (say) a paltry $100 billion, instead of his current $190 billion. [1] You could, for example, use some of the money from a "billionaire tax" to fund NASA.
- aeternum 6y ago
  >For a start it implies that becoming a multi-planet species would be impossible without Musk or Bezos holding vast personal wealth. There is no reason to believe that There is 50+ years of evidence that we will not become multi-planetary without private funding. The only reason NASA was funded enough to get to the moon in the first place was because of the cold war. Very unlikely it would have happened otherwise.
  - zjaffee 6y ago
    The soviet union was the first one to go into space and had far more of the outer space firsts than the US. They also had no market incentives to begin such projects. It's ridiculous you could even bring up the cold war without acknowledging the major scientific and engineering breakthroughs done by communist societies.
    - aeternum 6y ago
      Both the US and Soviet Union basically stole rocket tech and rocket scientists from Germany after WW2. The only reason the US and soviet governments supported and funded those rocketry efforts was due to the military and intelligence benefits.
- andrewtbham 6y ago
  It's true, it's possible a nation-state could colonize mars. But there is a problem for the US. Presidents come to office, scrap the previous adminstration's space goals, create their own new goals and then their's are scrapped by the next admin before they come to fruition. It takes more than 8 years (the max a president can serve) to really follow through on an ambitious vision for space. Billionaires can stick with it longer.
gowld 6y ago
Humanity will never becoming multi-planetary. Billionaires might become multi-plantery. The US was founded with an extreme class system -- slavery, and aristocratic-only male-only voting. The founders judgement is not sacrosanct.
- kuzimoto 6y ago
  > The US was founded with an extreme class system -- slavery, and aristocratic-only male-only voting. The US is the story of a country that is constantly struggling to live up to its founding ideology. Slavery was widespread globally at that time, and ended up fighting its most deadly war to end it. Over time its flaws were sought out and eradicated to give way to the most prosperous and free country in human history, all within a couple hundred years. The founders were not perfect (no one is), but did realize the evils of slavery and some did end up releasing their slaves.
ayemiller 6y ago
I think you misunderstand the purpose of taxes. They are not designed to kill people.

zentiggr 6y ago

And in the ensuing time, those with money and influence built up the class distinctions in the legal and tax codes. The comparison isn't an exact match, but the class distinction IS. Bezos may be contributing to the privatization of space, but he's doing it by exploiting the ones who keep the merchandise flowing through the cash cow. 19th century robber barons honed some of that machinery, Amazon has capitalized on and honed to a fine sharpness that blade.

big_youth 6y ago

>Billionaires are good for society. elon musk and jeff bezos are leading the way into space and that is huge for humanity. Enough with the blanket statements, Sure bill gates is ok but just yesterday the front page had a story of the Sackler family and how they amassed billions by pumping the united states with opiates. They literally killed thousands and ruined the lives of millions, while destroying American society. Billionaries are people, some evil some good. Also, the point of a government is to provide for it's citizens (with taxes) not to hope that in a 100years we can settle on other planets. And btw, in that scenario we would not be the ones who end up on Elysium. As much as SV programmers like to think they can be part the billionaire class you are not and will never be an oligarch.

mgkimsal 6y ago
going further, if sackler family started funding space exploration.... are they now good?
- chasd00 6y ago
  For the people who worship at the feet of Bill Gates the answer is definitely yes.
oblio 6y ago
Gates delayed the progress of the internet by about 5 years, intentionally. I know he's doing a lot of good lately, but let's also not forget the bad. Who knows how many other good things he's delayed indirectly because he delayed the internet so much?
- zepto 6y ago
  If not implementing things that later become important is immoral, we are all guilty. You could just as easily say that Gates advanced the progress of the internet by driving the price of PCs down so that more people owned them. It’s also reasonable to say that these decisions were a major reason why Microsoft lost their dominant position. Gates is rich, but he lost his power over the software industry over this.
kuzimoto 6y ago
> the point of a government is to provide for it's citizens (with taxes) Isn't this a sort of oxymoron? The taxes come from other citizens. The ones who are paying a majority of the taxes are not provided for by the government. Government should seek to provide everyone equal protection of their rights.
zepto 6y ago
I thought it was Doctors who pumped the United States full of opiates. I also thought the demand was a result of political policies that didn’t provide support for communities who were impoverished by the globalization of manufacturing and other industries. Yes, the Sackler’s profited, and were irredeemably bad actors in this, but they are just one part of the story.
achenatx 6y ago
Drugs should be legal and people should be allowed to buy and sell them. I would rather have the sackler family than the drug cartels. You believe the point of govt is to provide for its citizens, that doesnt make it a fact. Others believe the point of government is to protect us from each other while letting us make personal choices for good or ill.
wuliwong 6y ago
> the point of a government is to provide for it's citizens (with taxes) I this this is objectively incorrect for the USA.

monooso 6y ago

> Billionaires are good for society. elon musk and jeff bezos are leading the way into space and that is huge for humanity. If you tax them you will literally stop humanity from becoming multi-planetary. This argument really doesn't hold water. For a start it implies that becoming a multi-planet species would be impossible without Musk or Bezos holding vast personal wealth. There is no reason to believe that.[1] It also implies that Bezos couldn't possibly fund Blue Origin if he was worth (say) a paltry $100 billion, instead of his current $190 billion. [1] You could, for example, use some of the money from a "billionaire tax" to fund NASA.

aeternum 6y ago
>For a start it implies that becoming a multi-planet species would be impossible without Musk or Bezos holding vast personal wealth. There is no reason to believe that There is 50+ years of evidence that we will not become multi-planetary without private funding. The only reason NASA was funded enough to get to the moon in the first place was because of the cold war. Very unlikely it would have happened otherwise.
- zjaffee 6y ago
  The soviet union was the first one to go into space and had far more of the outer space firsts than the US. They also had no market incentives to begin such projects. It's ridiculous you could even bring up the cold war without acknowledging the major scientific and engineering breakthroughs done by communist societies.
  - aeternum 6y ago
    Both the US and Soviet Union basically stole rocket tech and rocket scientists from Germany after WW2. The only reason the US and soviet governments supported and funded those rocketry efforts was due to the military and intelligence benefits.
andrewtbham 6y ago
It's true, it's possible a nation-state could colonize mars. But there is a problem for the US. Presidents come to office, scrap the previous adminstration's space goals, create their own new goals and then their's are scrapped by the next admin before they come to fruition. It takes more than 8 years (the max a president can serve) to really follow through on an ambitious vision for space. Billionaires can stick with it longer.

gowld 6y ago

Humanity will never becoming multi-planetary. Billionaires might become multi-plantery. The US was founded with an extreme class system -- slavery, and aristocratic-only male-only voting. The founders judgement is not sacrosanct.

kuzimoto 6y ago
> The US was founded with an extreme class system -- slavery, and aristocratic-only male-only voting. The US is the story of a country that is constantly struggling to live up to its founding ideology. Slavery was widespread globally at that time, and ended up fighting its most deadly war to end it. Over time its flaws were sought out and eradicated to give way to the most prosperous and free country in human history, all within a couple hundred years. The founders were not perfect (no one is), but did realize the evils of slavery and some did end up releasing their slaves.

ayemiller 6y ago

I think you misunderstand the purpose of taxes. They are not designed to kill people.