3 ms·

> It’s very easy to confuse the emptiness of self with the nonexistence of self. I think part of the issue is that the words/concepts really don't translate in

by Igelau 6y ago

> It’s very easy to confuse the emptiness of self with the nonexistence of self. I think part of the issue is that the words/concepts really don't translate into modern english well at all. Another example is how frequently the first of the Four Noble Truths is misrepresented as "Life is suffering". We don't have good ways of saying or explaining shunyata or dukkha that preserve the nuance of the concepts. Edit: Thich Nhat Hanh is always a solid recommendation. I'll have to find his commentary on the heart sutra.

mtalantikite 6y ago
“I think part of the issue is that the words/concepts really don't translate into modern english well at all. Another example is how frequently the first of the Four Noble Truths is misrepresented as "Life is suffering".” Absolutely, translations are difficult and imprecise, having multiple meanings even in the original Sanskrit or Pāli. Even different lineages place concepts in different categories, like whether or not suffering is one of the three dharma seals or not. Vipassana as taught by the Theravada would say it is, whereas Mahayana and Vajrayana would sometimes say it’s not. No wonder new meditators get confused when they try to start a practice with all these modern apps and books that avoid teaching any of the lineages!
tyre 6y ago
Is there a longer translation that gives more nuance than "suffering"? Often times we settle for less precise words in favor of pithiness/conciseness.
- mtalantikite 6y ago
  For sure, the word is duhkha and has a lot of alternative meanings and explanations beyond just “suffering”: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duḥkha https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duḥkha
- hvs 6y ago
  I prefer "unsatisfactoriness" rather than "suffering". "The word is commonly explained as a derivation from Aryan terminology for an axle hole, referring to an axle hole which is not in the center and leads to a bumpy, uncomfortable ride."
  - taneq 6y ago
    Sounds like a better translation would be ‘slipshod’.
- dhimes 6y ago
  “Out of balance” is yet another way to think of it (Steve Hagen’s term IIRC)

by Igelau 6y ago

mtalantikite 6y ago

“I think part of the issue is that the words/concepts really don't translate into modern english well at all. Another example is how frequently the first of the Four Noble Truths is misrepresented as "Life is suffering".” Absolutely, translations are difficult and imprecise, having multiple meanings even in the original Sanskrit or Pāli. Even different lineages place concepts in different categories, like whether or not suffering is one of the three dharma seals or not. Vipassana as taught by the Theravada would say it is, whereas Mahayana and Vajrayana would sometimes say it’s not. No wonder new meditators get confused when they try to start a practice with all these modern apps and books that avoid teaching any of the lineages!

tyre 6y ago

Is there a longer translation that gives more nuance than "suffering"? Often times we settle for less precise words in favor of pithiness/conciseness.

mtalantikite 6y ago
For sure, the word is duhkha and has a lot of alternative meanings and explanations beyond just “suffering”: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duḥkha https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duḥkha
hvs 6y ago
I prefer "unsatisfactoriness" rather than "suffering". "The word is commonly explained as a derivation from Aryan terminology for an axle hole, referring to an axle hole which is not in the center and leads to a bumpy, uncomfortable ride."
- taneq 6y ago
  Sounds like a better translation would be ‘slipshod’.
dhimes 6y ago
“Out of balance” is yet another way to think of it (Steve Hagen’s term IIRC)