3 ms·

An obvious point not discussed is that the exams system was already biased to begin with. Previous years were already unfair as great kids at bad schools have m

An obvious point not discussed is that the exams system was already biased to begin with. Previous years were already unfair as great kids at bad schools have much fewer chances than less great kids for which the parents can pay a great school. England especially is awful at achieving a fair system (that gives everyone a fair chance at good grades) because schools are so stratified - by design of funding rules, etc.

throwaway_pdp09 6y ago
You're stating the obvious, a very well-known obvious. Perhaps you can suggest any system that is not intrinsically unfair (I'd be interested as I went both to schools in sink areas, and an expensive private school). (this was in the UK BTW) > ...is awful at achieving a fair system [...] because schools are so stratified - by design of funding rules etc. I'd say it was more down to the culture of parents in the poor areas mostly not giving a shit about their kid's education (and the roots of that aren't that the parents are intrinsically bad, it's a mindset of apathy inherited from their parents and the daily pressures that come with permanently worrying about money).
- CaptainZapp 6y ago
  I'm not surprised that you're downvoted and may be into oblivion. But you actually make a very valid point. That said I also believe that the current UK government is far beyond any benefit of a doubt in terms of competence and maliciousnes.
  - throwaway_pdp09 6y ago
    I'd prefer constructive comebacks from people rather than downvotes. I can't learn from downvotes. But OMG the competence of the UK govt. It's like they literally can't do... anything without screwing it up. It is bizarre. Then they try to paper over it with words.
    - CaptainZapp 6y ago
      I think it's mostly due to this statement: "I'd say it was more down to the culture of parents in the poor areas mostly not giving a shit about their kid's education" Which sounds nasty, but rings true for a big part of England. It's also an uncomfortable truth, which basically always leads to downvotes. Once a year (safe for this year, obviously) I'm in Blackpool at the Rebellion Punk Festival[1]. What you see in Blackpool and how people live there is very, very different from the impression you get when just visiting London. People wouldn't believe how poor and destitute some areas in the UK are and the priority of a lot of people in such areas is not really education. Young women want as many kids as possible, since government benefits beat the shitty work prospects they have in such areas and the future for young people in general in those places are so bleak that it often leads to an understandable "why bother?" attitude. And yes, this attitude is inherited, or actually worse. When there is a rare young person trying to be an achiever you can almost be sure he's mocked and bullied by his peers. [1] http://www.rebellionfestivals.com/ http://www.rebellionfestivals.com/
      - throwaway_pdp09 6y ago
        That is a most excellent response, and I agree with everything you say, including how and why that bit comes across nastily. Ta for that, I really must learn to be less of a tosser. > rare young person trying to be an achiever you can almost be sure he's mocked and bullied by his peers Yes. Someone on the web (maybe here, maybe slashdot) said that when someone tries, they're seen as trying to get above their station. Consequences follow. I spent a couple of years on a sink estate in the UK as a kid. I know what it does to people.

throwaway_pdp09 6y ago

You're stating the obvious, a very well-known obvious. Perhaps you can suggest any system that is not intrinsically unfair (I'd be interested as I went both to schools in sink areas, and an expensive private school). (this was in the UK BTW) > ...is awful at achieving a fair system [...] because schools are so stratified - by design of funding rules etc. I'd say it was more down to the culture of parents in the poor areas mostly not giving a shit about their kid's education (and the roots of that aren't that the parents are intrinsically bad, it's a mindset of apathy inherited from their parents and the daily pressures that come with permanently worrying about money).

CaptainZapp 6y ago
I'm not surprised that you're downvoted and may be into oblivion. But you actually make a very valid point. That said I also believe that the current UK government is far beyond any benefit of a doubt in terms of competence and maliciousnes.
- throwaway_pdp09 6y ago
  I'd prefer constructive comebacks from people rather than downvotes. I can't learn from downvotes. But OMG the competence of the UK govt. It's like they literally can't do... anything without screwing it up. It is bizarre. Then they try to paper over it with words.
  - CaptainZapp 6y ago
    I think it's mostly due to this statement: "I'd say it was more down to the culture of parents in the poor areas mostly not giving a shit about their kid's education" Which sounds nasty, but rings true for a big part of England. It's also an uncomfortable truth, which basically always leads to downvotes. Once a year (safe for this year, obviously) I'm in Blackpool at the Rebellion Punk Festival[1]. What you see in Blackpool and how people live there is very, very different from the impression you get when just visiting London. People wouldn't believe how poor and destitute some areas in the UK are and the priority of a lot of people in such areas is not really education. Young women want as many kids as possible, since government benefits beat the shitty work prospects they have in such areas and the future for young people in general in those places are so bleak that it often leads to an understandable "why bother?" attitude. And yes, this attitude is inherited, or actually worse. When there is a rare young person trying to be an achiever you can almost be sure he's mocked and bullied by his peers. [1] http://www.rebellionfestivals.com/ http://www.rebellionfestivals.com/
    - throwaway_pdp09 6y ago
      That is a most excellent response, and I agree with everything you say, including how and why that bit comes across nastily. Ta for that, I really must learn to be less of a tosser. > rare young person trying to be an achiever you can almost be sure he's mocked and bullied by his peers Yes. Someone on the web (maybe here, maybe slashdot) said that when someone tries, they're seen as trying to get above their station. Consequences follow. I spent a couple of years on a sink estate in the UK as a kid. I know what it does to people.