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I’ve been thinking for a long time that there is still a lot of opportunity for instruments like this - with a custom device OS, purpose built for music making,

I’ve been thinking for a long time that there is still a lot of opportunity for instruments like this - with a custom device OS, purpose built for music making, lots of I/O, good hardware interface. I wish music hardware manufacturers would just add an HDMI or display out on their devices, and then perhaps we could have a lot more screen real estate without needing a computer. Considering the number of times that desktop OS upgrades, desktop hardware problems, etc. have impacted using PC or Mac based DAWs, I don’t understand why manufacturers aren’t going more aggressively after specialized music devices (other than the cost). The new Akai MPC One or MPC X are pretty close to what I mean, but if they had just added a monitor output... even via USB, so one could get a larger screen experience...

lioeters 6y ago
> custom device OS, purpose-built for music making, lots of I/O, good hardware interface.. HDMI or display out.. There's a history of such devices built by/for professional and hobbyist musicians, and it seems increasingly it's becoming more accessible to the public, with low-cost microcomputers like Raspberry Pi. It might be too niche for big companies to care about, but I'm hoping that there's enough of a trend/demand for specialized music devices that are tiny computers one can hook up a monitor or SSH into, and hack to our hearts' desire. As a hobby project, I'm building a programmable sampler/sequencer with PiSound. It comes with a custom Linux distro for low-latency audio. https://www.blokas.io/pisound/ https://www.blokas.io/pisound/ https://blokas.io/patchbox-os/ https://blokas.io/patchbox-os/ I love that the musical possibilities are endless, extensible with commodity hardware and software. I believe there's plenty of room for innovative products that provide curated setups, like synths and drum machines.
- gregorysudderth 6y ago
  I for one would love to know more about this sequencer! I have a PiSound and am wondering if I can make a sequencer myself-- I'm inspired by Berndard Sumner--he made one (New Order). There is an idea floating around in my head of being able to describe rhythm patterns with just a few characters...and then branch them and control transitions between the branches, with some controller...arrows? Joystick?
  - lioeters 6y ago
    I'm still figuring it out, to be honest. Currently exploring launching (or controlling everything from) ChucK scripts: https://chuck.cs.princeton.edu https://chuck.cs.princeton.edu
omnibrain 6y ago
For sequencing there ist the "MIDIbox SEQ" http://www.ucapps.de/midibox_seq.html http://www.ucapps.de/midibox_seq.html and for audio there is the Axoloti-Board: http://www.axoloti.com/ http://www.axoloti.com/
- m0shen 6y ago
  There is also ELK Audio: https://elk.audio/store/ https://elk.audio/store/
wombatmobile 6y ago
> I don’t understand why manufacturers aren’t going more aggressively after specialized music devices (other than the cost). Because of cost... > The new Akai MPC One or MPC X are pretty close to what I mean, but if they had just added... and flexibility. Different users want different features and UI, at different price points. Software platforms let manufacturers please more people more of the time, without extensive product lifecycle dead time and irrecoverable sunken design and production costs.
metalgearsolid3 6y ago
You should spend less time thinking and more time looking because frankly there is a lot of dedicated hardware available. The options are endless. Perhaps you would like an Elektron Digitakt. You can connect it to your computer and use its VST to display an alternative UI on your computer screen.
- whatok 6y ago
  The VST integration is called Overbridge [0] and is available for all of the modern non-Model Elektron hardware. I understand the appeal for display options but to me besides sound, the whole point of hardware (especially drum machines) is workflow which is kind of at odds with looking up and down at a screen or using a mouse to to control things. Drum machine muscle memory is an extremely powerful force but I guess it also depends on what kind of music you're making or how many tracks you're using. I bought an Analog Rytm on the cheap a few months ago and have yet to plug it into a computer. Previously owned a Machinedrum UW and Monomachine nearly ten years ago which definitely helped with Elektron workflow familiarity. I've always found Elektrons to be easy to dive into but some of the other features definitely take some time to learn. Worth the time investment though. [0] https://www.elektron.se/overbridge/ https://www.elektron.se/overbridge/
  - moth-fuzz 6y ago
    > The VST integration is called Overbridge [0] and is available for all of the modern non-Model Elektron hardware. Unfortunately overbridge does not support the octatrack mkI/II in addition to the Model series.
    - whatok 6y ago
      Ah, that's right. I would have expected a refresh of that by now but the company has gone in a different direction with lower priced devices so who knows.
  - metalgearsolid3 6y ago
    I strongly agree that the whole point is workflow more than anything else. I use my Octatrack like a DAW so I don't even need a computer. My computer is more like a digital "tape" machine nowadays. My Machinedrum and Monomachine are to my left and right. :)
wdfx 6y ago
I've also been thinking along these lines; last month I built myself this: https://doug.lon.dev/software/hardware/2020/07/26/guitarix-pedal.html https://doug.lon.dev/software/hardware/2020/07/26/guitarix-p... Although I also plan to run different music apps on it, e.g. sampler or sequencer etc.
chrisjs96 6y ago
I've made a comment about this on hacker news before. It's only a Mac thing. You can install a 15 year old DAW on Windows still to this day. You can't install something from 3 years ago on Mac. That being said I use an Akai MPC Live and a Roland Fantom because I've been burned by OS and VST's. I only use a computer to arrange and finish the audio. It's also a better workflow for software developers because your not staring a computer screen to do music, which works for me. If you want a cheaper setup a MPC One and something like Yamaha Modx works fine too.
- lostgame 6y ago
  Ehh, this has mainly only been true since Catalina dropped 32 bit support. Although I still run a quad core G5 with 16GB RAM and 2x1TB SSDs to run Logic Pro 9 and a legacy version of Pro Tools I have a license to, amongst tons of PPC only VSTs. However, the dropping of 32-bit support was low, inexcusable, and just an overall dick move to the hardcore audio enthusiasts more than any other single demographic of MacOS users. What a backhanded move to a demographic they diligently worked so hard for years to retain and create a user base for. I've been using Apple products for about 16 years. More or less, due to sticking with Mojave, other than a few things I prefer on my G5, I can use those same tools today. The disappointing thing is since Catalina, alone; that's no longer the case. Pre-Catalina, I could state by experience your statement would be unequivocally untrue. Catalina needlessly makes me have to reconsider using the MacOS platform. For shame. Even if you're transitioning to ARM, there is no need to pointlessly deprecate what already works in the meantime. Just drop 32 bit support for ARM. Come on, guys. You're making a dedicated user of 15 years lose her faith, here. :/ You have taken a platform with an already limited amount of software and willingly decreased the amount of available software significantly with what you have called an upgrade. I can't possibly understand.
  - chrisjs96 6y ago
    It's not a Catalina thing. How long have you done music on Mac? Went through this with Snow leopard. Then with Mountain Lion. I can't install Rapture, Dimension Pro or Z3ta from Cakewalk after Mountain lion. Again Windows 10 just fine. Mac is a horrible platform for music and if I didn't do mobile development I would drop it in 5 seconds. Mac has literally become a joke in the computer music community.

lioeters 6y ago

> custom device OS, purpose-built for music making, lots of I/O, good hardware interface.. HDMI or display out.. There's a history of such devices built by/for professional and hobbyist musicians, and it seems increasingly it's becoming more accessible to the public, with low-cost microcomputers like Raspberry Pi. It might be too niche for big companies to care about, but I'm hoping that there's enough of a trend/demand for specialized music devices that are tiny computers one can hook up a monitor or SSH into, and hack to our hearts' desire. As a hobby project, I'm building a programmable sampler/sequencer with PiSound. It comes with a custom Linux distro for low-latency audio. https://www.blokas.io/pisound/ https://www.blokas.io/pisound/ https://blokas.io/patchbox-os/ https://blokas.io/patchbox-os/ I love that the musical possibilities are endless, extensible with commodity hardware and software. I believe there's plenty of room for innovative products that provide curated setups, like synths and drum machines.

gregorysudderth 6y ago
I for one would love to know more about this sequencer! I have a PiSound and am wondering if I can make a sequencer myself-- I'm inspired by Berndard Sumner--he made one (New Order). There is an idea floating around in my head of being able to describe rhythm patterns with just a few characters...and then branch them and control transitions between the branches, with some controller...arrows? Joystick?
- lioeters 6y ago
  I'm still figuring it out, to be honest. Currently exploring launching (or controlling everything from) ChucK scripts: https://chuck.cs.princeton.edu https://chuck.cs.princeton.edu

omnibrain 6y ago

For sequencing there ist the "MIDIbox SEQ" http://www.ucapps.de/midibox_seq.html http://www.ucapps.de/midibox_seq.html and for audio there is the Axoloti-Board: http://www.axoloti.com/ http://www.axoloti.com/

m0shen 6y ago
There is also ELK Audio: https://elk.audio/store/ https://elk.audio/store/

wombatmobile 6y ago

> I don’t understand why manufacturers aren’t going more aggressively after specialized music devices (other than the cost). Because of cost... > The new Akai MPC One or MPC X are pretty close to what I mean, but if they had just added... and flexibility. Different users want different features and UI, at different price points. Software platforms let manufacturers please more people more of the time, without extensive product lifecycle dead time and irrecoverable sunken design and production costs.

metalgearsolid3 6y ago

You should spend less time thinking and more time looking because frankly there is a lot of dedicated hardware available. The options are endless. Perhaps you would like an Elektron Digitakt. You can connect it to your computer and use its VST to display an alternative UI on your computer screen.

whatok 6y ago
The VST integration is called Overbridge [0] and is available for all of the modern non-Model Elektron hardware. I understand the appeal for display options but to me besides sound, the whole point of hardware (especially drum machines) is workflow which is kind of at odds with looking up and down at a screen or using a mouse to to control things. Drum machine muscle memory is an extremely powerful force but I guess it also depends on what kind of music you're making or how many tracks you're using. I bought an Analog Rytm on the cheap a few months ago and have yet to plug it into a computer. Previously owned a Machinedrum UW and Monomachine nearly ten years ago which definitely helped with Elektron workflow familiarity. I've always found Elektrons to be easy to dive into but some of the other features definitely take some time to learn. Worth the time investment though. [0] https://www.elektron.se/overbridge/ https://www.elektron.se/overbridge/
- moth-fuzz 6y ago
  > The VST integration is called Overbridge [0] and is available for all of the modern non-Model Elektron hardware. Unfortunately overbridge does not support the octatrack mkI/II in addition to the Model series.
  - whatok 6y ago
    Ah, that's right. I would have expected a refresh of that by now but the company has gone in a different direction with lower priced devices so who knows.
- metalgearsolid3 6y ago
  I strongly agree that the whole point is workflow more than anything else. I use my Octatrack like a DAW so I don't even need a computer. My computer is more like a digital "tape" machine nowadays. My Machinedrum and Monomachine are to my left and right. :)

wdfx 6y ago

I've also been thinking along these lines; last month I built myself this: https://doug.lon.dev/software/hardware/2020/07/26/guitarix-pedal.html https://doug.lon.dev/software/hardware/2020/07/26/guitarix-p... Although I also plan to run different music apps on it, e.g. sampler or sequencer etc.

chrisjs96 6y ago

I've made a comment about this on hacker news before. It's only a Mac thing. You can install a 15 year old DAW on Windows still to this day. You can't install something from 3 years ago on Mac. That being said I use an Akai MPC Live and a Roland Fantom because I've been burned by OS and VST's. I only use a computer to arrange and finish the audio. It's also a better workflow for software developers because your not staring a computer screen to do music, which works for me. If you want a cheaper setup a MPC One and something like Yamaha Modx works fine too.

lostgame 6y ago
Ehh, this has mainly only been true since Catalina dropped 32 bit support. Although I still run a quad core G5 with 16GB RAM and 2x1TB SSDs to run Logic Pro 9 and a legacy version of Pro Tools I have a license to, amongst tons of PPC only VSTs. However, the dropping of 32-bit support was low, inexcusable, and just an overall dick move to the hardcore audio enthusiasts more than any other single demographic of MacOS users. What a backhanded move to a demographic they diligently worked so hard for years to retain and create a user base for. I've been using Apple products for about 16 years. More or less, due to sticking with Mojave, other than a few things I prefer on my G5, I can use those same tools today. The disappointing thing is since Catalina, alone; that's no longer the case. Pre-Catalina, I could state by experience your statement would be unequivocally untrue. Catalina needlessly makes me have to reconsider using the MacOS platform. For shame. Even if you're transitioning to ARM, there is no need to pointlessly deprecate what already works in the meantime. Just drop 32 bit support for ARM. Come on, guys. You're making a dedicated user of 15 years lose her faith, here. :/ You have taken a platform with an already limited amount of software and willingly decreased the amount of available software significantly with what you have called an upgrade. I can't possibly understand.
- chrisjs96 6y ago
  It's not a Catalina thing. How long have you done music on Mac? Went through this with Snow leopard. Then with Mountain Lion. I can't install Rapture, Dimension Pro or Z3ta from Cakewalk after Mountain lion. Again Windows 10 just fine. Mac is a horrible platform for music and if I didn't do mobile development I would drop it in 5 seconds. Mac has literally become a joke in the computer music community.