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Hacker News: implementing an incomplete subset of Web standards to focus on things that matter to everyone, like performance and privacy, is a great idea. Also

by fay59 6y ago

Hacker News: implementing an incomplete subset of Web standards to focus on things that matter to everyone, like performance and privacy, is a great idea. Also Hacker News: fuck Safari.

rmdashrfstar 6y ago
I, for one, love Safari! I will use Safari on MacOS and Firefox on Linux, but only Chrome for frontend development and testing...
kelnos 6y ago
Safari isn't that useful for people not using a Mac or iPhone/iPad, which is most people. Also: don't paint us all with such a broad brush. I'm pretty indifferent toward Safari. "Fuck Safari" would imply I care enough to have a strong opinion about it, which I don't.
kabacha 6y ago
How is safari focusing on performance and privacy? AFAIK its the worst performing browser and easiest one to fingerprint.
- andai 6y ago
  Tangential to performance, but last I used it (2018ish) Safari had by far the best power efficiency, which is important when running on battery power (iOS and MacBooks are Apple's most popular devices). It was like a 2-3X difference, doubling the battery life. I thought that was really interesting, how much they optimized for that, and how Chrome seemingly did not at all.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - dahfizz 6y ago
    That's pretty surprising, considering chrome on iOS is basically just a safari skin. Is there a more in depth look at this anywhere?
    - wtmt 6y ago
      I’m pretty sure the GP is referring to battery usage comparisons on Mac and not iOS. There may be battery use differences on iOS too (the UI, networking and other pieces are still Chrome’s), but not of the magnitude described here.
      - andai 6y ago
        Since Chrome on iOS is mostly safari (as far as the heavy lifting goes), I expect Chrome on iOS is easier on battery than it is on Android. My meaning was that Safari is heavily optimized for power usage because most people using it are on mobile devices, and the difference is dramatic, at least on macOS where you can compare it. I wonder how Chrome's traffic compares across mobile, laptop and desktop (I don't think laptops can be detected in browser stats). They certainly seem to focus on maximum performance above all else.
  - Smerity 6y ago
    From what I understand (speaking casually to someone on the Google Chrome team) Safari is able to integrate into operating system level APIs that are not available for other applications, impacting especially power efficiency.
- millstone 6y ago
  Safari is very fast, not sure where you got the idea that it's slow? Safari's tracking protection works very well; we know because Safari ad prices have dropped significantly: https://appleinsider.com/articles/19/12/09/apples-safari-ad-tracking-prevention-tech-stunningly-effective-says-industry-executives https://appleinsider.com/articles/19/12/09/apples-safari-ad-...
  - refresher 6y ago
    Safari page loading is fast but from my experience the actual app is slow (on the newest MBP no less). It's the only browser where I can type something into the URL bar and press enter quickly, expecting it will take me to the top history result (e.g. type 'tw' and press enter to go to twitter.com) but actually beat out the loading of the history / bookmarks results and have Safari simply google the string 'tw' instead. This happens all the time for me in Safari and never happened once in Chrome.
  - darthrupert 6y ago
    If only Safari had something comparable to uMatrix, uBlock and youtube enchancer suite. But apparently the APIs that would’ve been useful for the first two are a bit crippled in the latest Safari. Hopefully this can be fixed some day. I’d gladly switch from Firefox.
avasthe 6y ago
> Also Hacker News: fuck Safari. We are all talking about something between Lynx and Safari.
zelphirkalt 6y ago
Although afaik Safari is the only one which has TCO for JavaScript? (Correct me if I am wrong!) So while I do not like Safari, it seems to have done that right.
Vinnl 6y ago
These kinds of comments always puzzle me. They basically come down to: "Some people on this website have one opinion, and other people on this website have another. People on this website are inconsistent."
- BoDlulu 6y ago
  Sometimes it's the same people - yes, people have contradictions, what a surprise!

by fay59 6y ago

Hacker News: implementing an incomplete subset of Web standards to focus on things that matter to everyone, like performance and privacy, is a great idea. Also Hacker News: fuck Safari.

rmdashrfstar 6y ago

I, for one, love Safari! I will use Safari on MacOS and Firefox on Linux, but only Chrome for frontend development and testing...

kelnos 6y ago

Safari isn't that useful for people not using a Mac or iPhone/iPad, which is most people. Also: don't paint us all with such a broad brush. I'm pretty indifferent toward Safari. "Fuck Safari" would imply I care enough to have a strong opinion about it, which I don't.

kabacha 6y ago

How is safari focusing on performance and privacy? AFAIK its the worst performing browser and easiest one to fingerprint.

andai 6y ago
Tangential to performance, but last I used it (2018ish) Safari had by far the best power efficiency, which is important when running on battery power (iOS and MacBooks are Apple's most popular devices). It was like a 2-3X difference, doubling the battery life. I thought that was really interesting, how much they optimized for that, and how Chrome seemingly did not at all.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- dahfizz 6y ago
  That's pretty surprising, considering chrome on iOS is basically just a safari skin. Is there a more in depth look at this anywhere?
  - wtmt 6y ago
    I’m pretty sure the GP is referring to battery usage comparisons on Mac and not iOS. There may be battery use differences on iOS too (the UI, networking and other pieces are still Chrome’s), but not of the magnitude described here.
    - andai 6y ago
      Since Chrome on iOS is mostly safari (as far as the heavy lifting goes), I expect Chrome on iOS is easier on battery than it is on Android. My meaning was that Safari is heavily optimized for power usage because most people using it are on mobile devices, and the difference is dramatic, at least on macOS where you can compare it. I wonder how Chrome's traffic compares across mobile, laptop and desktop (I don't think laptops can be detected in browser stats). They certainly seem to focus on maximum performance above all else.
- Smerity 6y ago
  From what I understand (speaking casually to someone on the Google Chrome team) Safari is able to integrate into operating system level APIs that are not available for other applications, impacting especially power efficiency.
millstone 6y ago
Safari is very fast, not sure where you got the idea that it's slow? Safari's tracking protection works very well; we know because Safari ad prices have dropped significantly: https://appleinsider.com/articles/19/12/09/apples-safari-ad-tracking-prevention-tech-stunningly-effective-says-industry-executives https://appleinsider.com/articles/19/12/09/apples-safari-ad-...
- refresher 6y ago
  Safari page loading is fast but from my experience the actual app is slow (on the newest MBP no less). It's the only browser where I can type something into the URL bar and press enter quickly, expecting it will take me to the top history result (e.g. type 'tw' and press enter to go to twitter.com) but actually beat out the loading of the history / bookmarks results and have Safari simply google the string 'tw' instead. This happens all the time for me in Safari and never happened once in Chrome.
- darthrupert 6y ago
  If only Safari had something comparable to uMatrix, uBlock and youtube enchancer suite. But apparently the APIs that would’ve been useful for the first two are a bit crippled in the latest Safari. Hopefully this can be fixed some day. I’d gladly switch from Firefox.

avasthe 6y ago

> Also Hacker News: fuck Safari. We are all talking about something between Lynx and Safari.

zelphirkalt 6y ago

Although afaik Safari is the only one which has TCO for JavaScript? (Correct me if I am wrong!) So while I do not like Safari, it seems to have done that right.

Vinnl 6y ago

These kinds of comments always puzzle me. They basically come down to: "Some people on this website have one opinion, and other people on this website have another. People on this website are inconsistent."

BoDlulu 6y ago
Sometimes it's the same people - yes, people have contradictions, what a surprise!