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Wow, that's a loaded comment that makes a lot of assumptions about me. I am not against connectivity or improving the life of people there, a lot of these area

Wow, that's a loaded comment that makes a lot of assumptions about me. I am not against connectivity or improving the life of people there, a lot of these areas are already connected by metalled road. What was happening when I was traveling there was widening of the roads indiscriminately, if you talk to people there or even read some of the articles I have linked, there isn't much benefit that local people are seeing because of this. There are far more important things that would have been beneficial to people living there like education, healthcare and some of them can be improved drastically with something as simple as improving LTE coverage. All I am saying is, I would have preferred to see the myriad of problems associated with the project addressed, I am not saying do not build, but build sustainably. About the metrics you think that haven't degraded, I don't have sources ready on all of them but I just looked up forest cover and one of the most green regions is now covered with plantations a lot. [1] Plantation cover != Forest cover. Lastly, just because I am wearing Patagonia/North Face because of their environmental commitments, doesn't mean I expect everyone else to do the same. There are other paths, which might not be perfect but will be better, it doesn't hurt to raise issues when you see them so you can explore those paths. The choice is not binary. [1] https://bucketeer-e05bbc84-baa3-437e-9518-adb32be77984.s3.amazonaws.com/public/images/d586f57c-6ef3-42e5-a68c-031b10d950b9_586x631.png https://bucketeer-e05bbc84-baa3-437e-9518-adb32be77984.s3.am...

haltingproblem 6y ago
Sentences like this betray your intent: What was happening when I was traveling there was widening of the roads indiscriminately Surely you know better than the urban planners and the engineers who are widening roads indiscriminately. or there isn't much benefit that local people are seeing because of this. How long did you wait before you polled the locals for benefits? What timeline in your opinion is valid for benefits to accrue - 1 year? 3 years? Apologies if it came across as harsh but I do appreciate your comment. I used your comment as a template for the general environmentalist anathema in third-world nations like India against development which disproportionately helps the poor. The upper socio-economic classes everywhere are against further development be it the home owners of SF who rail against high density housing, the mansion owners of nantucket who hate off shore windmills, the woke classes of Mumbai who protest the cutting of 300 trees to stop development of a metro line which will disproportionately help the mass-transit commuting poor. Sustainability - that vague bogey of the anti-development movement. Oft used but never defined. I am not too different than you. I would love the earth to be pristine so when I visit distant locales I can enjoy untouched panoramas. I just value the quality of the life of the locals more than my view.
- actuator 6y ago
  > Surely you know better than the urban planners and the engineers who are widening roads indiscriminately. When I used the word indiscriminate, there was a specific purpose to it. It doesn't have to be that the engineers or planners don't know the better way to do it. It just might be that they choose to pick the cheapest way they can get away with, or do you deny that in developing countries corruption is not high and implementation of laws is not lax. I have specifically mentioned examples in one of the other replies of things that they have done indiscriminately. Filling up narrow valleys with debris or destroying vegetation below the road slope by just leaving the debris there certainly isn't smart; nor is cutting slopes in the cheapest way to leave them prone to landslides. There are ways to activley manage it which have been employed throughout the world. As I said, even when I had searched in the past the media coverage on this was poor which is surprising. But here are few links which discuss the issues I mentioned in the comment. - https://www.newindianexpress.com/nation/2020/jul/21/char-dham-pariyojana-hpc-report-says-socio-cultural-concern-innovative-thought-largely-missing-2172741.amp https://www.newindianexpress.com/nation/2020/jul/21/char-dha... - https://www.downtoearth.org.in/news/environment/char-dham-national-highway-has-cost-uttarakhand-its-ecological-balance-62661 https://www.downtoearth.org.in/news/environment/char-dham-na...
  - haltingproblem 6y ago
    You are playing whack-a-mole here. It just might be that they choose to pick the cheapest way they can get away with, Of course you know the most optimal trade-off between costs, quality and the environment not folks who are building thousands of miles of roadway every year. do you deny that in developing countries corruption is not high and implementation of laws is not lax. Straw man. There is corruption everywhere even in the west. Because there is corruption, nothing should happen. Filling up narrow valleys with debris or destroying vegetation below the road slope by just leaving the debris there certainly isn't smart; nor is cutting slopes in the cheapest way to leave them prone to landslides. You know a better way? How do you know dumping it in the valley below is worse than carting it off and dumping it in a remote valley. Do you have data showing where it should be dumped? Have you talked to any transportation engineers. Let me allow that it is worse and causes landslides. Are those landslides worse than having wider safer roads? Your arguments have too much innuendo, conjecture because you have an defacto ideological position. You are fundamentally opposed to all development as it no longer serves your needs. Just ponder that.

haltingproblem 6y ago

Sentences like this betray your intent: What was happening when I was traveling there was widening of the roads indiscriminately Surely you know better than the urban planners and the engineers who are widening roads indiscriminately. or there isn't much benefit that local people are seeing because of this. How long did you wait before you polled the locals for benefits? What timeline in your opinion is valid for benefits to accrue - 1 year? 3 years? Apologies if it came across as harsh but I do appreciate your comment. I used your comment as a template for the general environmentalist anathema in third-world nations like India against development which disproportionately helps the poor. The upper socio-economic classes everywhere are against further development be it the home owners of SF who rail against high density housing, the mansion owners of nantucket who hate off shore windmills, the woke classes of Mumbai who protest the cutting of 300 trees to stop development of a metro line which will disproportionately help the mass-transit commuting poor. Sustainability - that vague bogey of the anti-development movement. Oft used but never defined. I am not too different than you. I would love the earth to be pristine so when I visit distant locales I can enjoy untouched panoramas. I just value the quality of the life of the locals more than my view.

actuator 6y ago
> Surely you know better than the urban planners and the engineers who are widening roads indiscriminately. When I used the word indiscriminate, there was a specific purpose to it. It doesn't have to be that the engineers or planners don't know the better way to do it. It just might be that they choose to pick the cheapest way they can get away with, or do you deny that in developing countries corruption is not high and implementation of laws is not lax. I have specifically mentioned examples in one of the other replies of things that they have done indiscriminately. Filling up narrow valleys with debris or destroying vegetation below the road slope by just leaving the debris there certainly isn't smart; nor is cutting slopes in the cheapest way to leave them prone to landslides. There are ways to activley manage it which have been employed throughout the world. As I said, even when I had searched in the past the media coverage on this was poor which is surprising. But here are few links which discuss the issues I mentioned in the comment. - https://www.newindianexpress.com/nation/2020/jul/21/char-dham-pariyojana-hpc-report-says-socio-cultural-concern-innovative-thought-largely-missing-2172741.amp https://www.newindianexpress.com/nation/2020/jul/21/char-dha... - https://www.downtoearth.org.in/news/environment/char-dham-national-highway-has-cost-uttarakhand-its-ecological-balance-62661 https://www.downtoearth.org.in/news/environment/char-dham-na...
- haltingproblem 6y ago
  You are playing whack-a-mole here. It just might be that they choose to pick the cheapest way they can get away with, Of course you know the most optimal trade-off between costs, quality and the environment not folks who are building thousands of miles of roadway every year. do you deny that in developing countries corruption is not high and implementation of laws is not lax. Straw man. There is corruption everywhere even in the west. Because there is corruption, nothing should happen. Filling up narrow valleys with debris or destroying vegetation below the road slope by just leaving the debris there certainly isn't smart; nor is cutting slopes in the cheapest way to leave them prone to landslides. You know a better way? How do you know dumping it in the valley below is worse than carting it off and dumping it in a remote valley. Do you have data showing where it should be dumped? Have you talked to any transportation engineers. Let me allow that it is worse and causes landslides. Are those landslides worse than having wider safer roads? Your arguments have too much innuendo, conjecture because you have an defacto ideological position. You are fundamentally opposed to all development as it no longer serves your needs. Just ponder that.