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Musk makes me nervous that he and his team are going to push too far and too fast with putting self-driving in the hands of real users and the ensuing disaster/

Musk makes me nervous that he and his team are going to push too far and too fast with putting self-driving in the hands of real users and the ensuing disaster/public outcry is going to be cataclysmic to the self-driving field. The whole "automatically have your car come to where you are in the parking lot" was a great example of an obvious disaster in the making that they made public anyway. I hope I'm wrong.

Waterluvian 6y ago
The worst is all the other people on the roads and sidewalks that might pay the price for rich people gadgetry and Silicon Valley move fast and kill people.
- kfarr 6y ago
  Already happened: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Elaine_Herzberg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Elaine_Herzberg
  - sharken 6y ago
    Not using the designated pedestrian crosswalk is a very unsafe practice. Still, we should expect autonomous vehicles to cope with that, which is certainly not the case yet.
    - 1DRACOSEA8 6y ago
      Get your shorts ready everybody.
canada_dry 6y ago
While the potential excites me (self-driving cars can't come fast enough IMHO - I despise driving) I agree. Tesla has been given an incredibly long rope by regulators and it'll just take a really terrible accident or two to bring it all to a screeching halt. It's hard to imagine Elon not realizing this, but the incessant drive to the endgame may cloud his judgement.
- toomuchtodo 6y ago
  ~33k people a year (About 90 per day) die in car accidents in the US because of humans. It’s us who have been given the long rope There have been four deaths while Autopilot was engaged [1], almost all because the drivers weren’t paying attention. Autopilot has been used for 3 billion miles, 1 billion with Navigate on Autopilot (automatic passing and interchange routing), and 200,000 automated lane changes [2]. Is this not impressive? Yes, self driving is hard. Yes, there will be fatalities due to edge cases. It is unreasonable to confine the tech to a test track until it’s perfect, considering the human incurred death rate as it stands. We should be racing to take the person out of the driver’s seat. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_self-driving_car_fatalities https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_self-driving_car_fatal... [2] https://electrek.co/2020/04/22/tesla-autopilot-data-3-billion-miles/ https://electrek.co/2020/04/22/tesla-autopilot-data-3-billio...
  - canada_dry 6y ago
    I tend to agree with everything you've said... however... The cold-hard-reality is that if a self-driving car of any make were to careen into a school-bus full of children and burst into flames all automakers would very likely face severe restrictions going forward.
    - toomuchtodo 6y ago
      Let’s hope self driving turns the corner before human irrationality holds us back even more than it already does.
      - NoOneNew 6y ago
        You know, for a long, long time Apple users claimed that Macs were unhackable. That was part of the hype and appeal for a long time. Problem was, Macs didn't reach critical mass in market penetration during those "unhackable years". Once there were enough in the general public to make it worth hacking, people start noticing/realizing that Macs weren't special, just irrelevant for a long time. Same goes for self-driving cars. Critical mass has not been reached, not by a long shot. Most miles driven by autopilot cars have been supervised by either trained or very attentive drivers or even in very controlled environments. In other words, not how autopilot will be used in the real world what so ever. Because that's not the point. Either the car drives by itself or the person is driving. Not half here, half there. This is where the fear and hesitation exists. Will autopilot be inevitable? Probably. But Silicon Valley's cult like attitude to "break things fast" is not the attitude I want behind the software that is going to drive me to work or make me headless like the dude that crashed into a semitruck in Florida. At 33, I'm perfectly good at driving and will place my own life in my hands if "break things fast" is going to be their little bonfire chant. Someone else's idea of "the greater good" doesn't always live up to expectations.

Waterluvian 6y ago

The worst is all the other people on the roads and sidewalks that might pay the price for rich people gadgetry and Silicon Valley move fast and kill people.

kfarr 6y ago
Already happened: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Elaine_Herzberg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Elaine_Herzberg
- sharken 6y ago
  Not using the designated pedestrian crosswalk is a very unsafe practice. Still, we should expect autonomous vehicles to cope with that, which is certainly not the case yet.
  - 1DRACOSEA8 6y ago
    Get your shorts ready everybody.

canada_dry 6y ago

While the potential excites me (self-driving cars can't come fast enough IMHO - I despise driving) I agree. Tesla has been given an incredibly long rope by regulators and it'll just take a really terrible accident or two to bring it all to a screeching halt. It's hard to imagine Elon not realizing this, but the incessant drive to the endgame may cloud his judgement.

toomuchtodo 6y ago
~33k people a year (About 90 per day) die in car accidents in the US because of humans. It’s us who have been given the long rope There have been four deaths while Autopilot was engaged [1], almost all because the drivers weren’t paying attention. Autopilot has been used for 3 billion miles, 1 billion with Navigate on Autopilot (automatic passing and interchange routing), and 200,000 automated lane changes [2]. Is this not impressive? Yes, self driving is hard. Yes, there will be fatalities due to edge cases. It is unreasonable to confine the tech to a test track until it’s perfect, considering the human incurred death rate as it stands. We should be racing to take the person out of the driver’s seat. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_self-driving_car_fatalities https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_self-driving_car_fatal... [2] https://electrek.co/2020/04/22/tesla-autopilot-data-3-billion-miles/ https://electrek.co/2020/04/22/tesla-autopilot-data-3-billio...
- canada_dry 6y ago
  I tend to agree with everything you've said... however... The cold-hard-reality is that if a self-driving car of any make were to careen into a school-bus full of children and burst into flames all automakers would very likely face severe restrictions going forward.
  - toomuchtodo 6y ago
    Let’s hope self driving turns the corner before human irrationality holds us back even more than it already does.
    - NoOneNew 6y ago
      You know, for a long, long time Apple users claimed that Macs were unhackable. That was part of the hype and appeal for a long time. Problem was, Macs didn't reach critical mass in market penetration during those "unhackable years". Once there were enough in the general public to make it worth hacking, people start noticing/realizing that Macs weren't special, just irrelevant for a long time. Same goes for self-driving cars. Critical mass has not been reached, not by a long shot. Most miles driven by autopilot cars have been supervised by either trained or very attentive drivers or even in very controlled environments. In other words, not how autopilot will be used in the real world what so ever. Because that's not the point. Either the car drives by itself or the person is driving. Not half here, half there. This is where the fear and hesitation exists. Will autopilot be inevitable? Probably. But Silicon Valley's cult like attitude to "break things fast" is not the attitude I want behind the software that is going to drive me to work or make me headless like the dude that crashed into a semitruck in Florida. At 33, I'm perfectly good at driving and will place my own life in my hands if "break things fast" is going to be their little bonfire chant. Someone else's idea of "the greater good" doesn't always live up to expectations.