4 ms·

Why is Vietnamese the right kind of Asian?

scruple 6y ago
It's not that Vietnamese is the "right kind" of Asian. It's that Chinese-Americans dominate the landscape compared to Vietnamese-Americans. So here you have a Vietnamese-American who has excelled (just ever so slightly, in his case) beyond his immediate Chinese-American peers, which made him a standout in that regard.
- usaar333 6y ago
  True, but Vietnamese Americans are well represented in undergrad at least. In fact about double the white representation in UCs (https://www.universityofcalifornia.edu/infocenter/disaggregated-data https://www.universityofcalifornia.edu/infocenter/disaggrega...)
  - scruple 6y ago
    What's the representation at Yale, I wonder. Without checking I just assume that (from living in SoCal for a long time) California has most of the country's Vietnamese-Americans.
    - reaperducer 6y ago
      I just assume that (from living in SoCal for a long time) California has most of the country's Vietnamese-Americans There's a very large Vietnamese population in Houston. Probably other cities.
      - scruple 6y ago
        I'm finally off my phone, so I had a look. There's a Wikipedia on it here [0]. [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._cities_with_large_Vietnamese-American_populations https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._cities_with_large...
- sizzle 6y ago
  By that logic, what about Taiwanese?
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - scruple 6y ago
    Well that's complicated. I believe that it's been made deliberately confusing (the geopolitical issues between the People's Republic of China and the Republic of China are at least known to exist today) and it's pretty hard to talk about. I wanna tap out of this conversation before I even say anything about it because I feel like it's way over my head. But, in the very specific context of what I was saying regarding university admissions in 2017, I don't think there was a lot that a Taiwanese-American person could do to distinguish themselves from being labeled or otherwise considered Chinese-American.
pedroma 6y ago
It's like finding a rare Pokemon, except human.
- kabacha 6y ago
  Vietnamese Americans: 1.3M[1] Chinese Americans: 2.5M[2] It's almost double, but is it really on a rare pokemon level? 1 - https://www.migrationpolicy.org/article/vietnamese-immigrants-united-states-5 https://www.migrationpolicy.org/article/vietnamese-immigrant... 2 - https://www.migrationpolicy.org/article/chinese-immigrants-united-states-2018 https://www.migrationpolicy.org/article/chinese-immigrants-u...
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - pedroma 6y ago
    I'm curious to see how many applications they get from ethnically Chinese and Vietnamese students. My guess is there's much more ethnically Chinese applicants (which includes international students).
xapata 6y ago
For a light-hearted take, Google Ali Wong's bit about Jungle Asians. The gist is that different waves of immigrants from different countries ended up with wildly different average socioeconomic outcomes in the US. Even different waves from the same country. Sadly, cohort matters. Note that Vietnamese here is good, because in other situations, it ain't good. The college admissions context is a confounder that flips the desirability of being a particular ethnicity.
sbierwagen 6y ago
Average household income, Vietnamese American, 2018: $67,331 Average household income, Chinese American, excluding Taiwanese, 2018: $91,944 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ethnic_groups_in_the_United_States_by_household_income https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ethnic_groups_in_the_U...
- DataWorker 6y ago
  There are simply more Chinese so brain drain will be more pronounced. But I would also speculate that a larger percentage of Vietnamese are second generation or more. Very true in little Saigon. Poor Vietnamese who were born in the USA live in east San Jose, Chinese live in Cupertino. Very different levels of privilege.
  - scruple 6y ago
    You see this in Orange county, too. Garden Grove and Westminster vs. Irvine.
  - xapata 6y ago
    That would only be true if the US allowed only the same number of immigrants from each country. I don't think that's been the policy historically. I'm not familiar with the current policy. People immigrate for different reasons at different times. The causes combine with changing US immigration policies and the dynamics of preferential attachment to diaspora clusters to create distinct cohorts that have similar socioeconomic outcomes.

It's not that Vietnamese is the "right kind" of Asian. It's that Chinese-Americans dominate the landscape compared to Vietnamese-Americans. So here you have a Vietnamese-American who has excelled (just ever so slightly, in his case) beyond his immediate Chinese-American peers, which made him a standout in that regard.

usaar333 6y ago
True, but Vietnamese Americans are well represented in undergrad at least. In fact about double the white representation in UCs (https://www.universityofcalifornia.edu/infocenter/disaggregated-data https://www.universityofcalifornia.edu/infocenter/disaggrega...)
- scruple 6y ago
  What's the representation at Yale, I wonder. Without checking I just assume that (from living in SoCal for a long time) California has most of the country's Vietnamese-Americans.
  - reaperducer 6y ago
    I just assume that (from living in SoCal for a long time) California has most of the country's Vietnamese-Americans There's a very large Vietnamese population in Houston. Probably other cities.
    - scruple 6y ago
      I'm finally off my phone, so I had a look. There's a Wikipedia on it here [0]. [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._cities_with_large_Vietnamese-American_populations https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._cities_with_large...
sizzle 6y ago
By that logic, what about Taiwanese?
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- scruple 6y ago
  Well that's complicated. I believe that it's been made deliberately confusing (the geopolitical issues between the People's Republic of China and the Republic of China are at least known to exist today) and it's pretty hard to talk about. I wanna tap out of this conversation before I even say anything about it because I feel like it's way over my head. But, in the very specific context of what I was saying regarding university admissions in 2017, I don't think there was a lot that a Taiwanese-American person could do to distinguish themselves from being labeled or otherwise considered Chinese-American.

pedroma 6y ago

It's like finding a rare Pokemon, except human.

kabacha 6y ago
Vietnamese Americans: 1.3M[1] Chinese Americans: 2.5M[2] It's almost double, but is it really on a rare pokemon level? 1 - https://www.migrationpolicy.org/article/vietnamese-immigrants-united-states-5 https://www.migrationpolicy.org/article/vietnamese-immigrant... 2 - https://www.migrationpolicy.org/article/chinese-immigrants-united-states-2018 https://www.migrationpolicy.org/article/chinese-immigrants-u...
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- pedroma 6y ago
  I'm curious to see how many applications they get from ethnically Chinese and Vietnamese students. My guess is there's much more ethnically Chinese applicants (which includes international students).

xapata 6y ago

For a light-hearted take, Google Ali Wong's bit about Jungle Asians. The gist is that different waves of immigrants from different countries ended up with wildly different average socioeconomic outcomes in the US. Even different waves from the same country. Sadly, cohort matters. Note that Vietnamese here is good, because in other situations, it ain't good. The college admissions context is a confounder that flips the desirability of being a particular ethnicity.

sbierwagen 6y ago

Average household income, Vietnamese American, 2018: $67,331 Average household income, Chinese American, excluding Taiwanese, 2018: $91,944 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ethnic_groups_in_the_United_States_by_household_income https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ethnic_groups_in_the_U...

DataWorker 6y ago
There are simply more Chinese so brain drain will be more pronounced. But I would also speculate that a larger percentage of Vietnamese are second generation or more. Very true in little Saigon. Poor Vietnamese who were born in the USA live in east San Jose, Chinese live in Cupertino. Very different levels of privilege.
- scruple 6y ago
  You see this in Orange county, too. Garden Grove and Westminster vs. Irvine.
- xapata 6y ago
  That would only be true if the US allowed only the same number of immigrants from each country. I don't think that's been the policy historically. I'm not familiar with the current policy. People immigrate for different reasons at different times. The causes combine with changing US immigration policies and the dynamics of preferential attachment to diaspora clusters to create distinct cohorts that have similar socioeconomic outcomes.