4 ms·

Does Mozilla not make enough money to sustain long term investments?

by kiba 6y ago

deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
ChrisSD 6y ago
Mozilla Corp currently doesn't make much money at all, hence their problems. The majority of their funds come from a recurring Google donation, which has to be renewed every few years.
- kryptiskt 6y ago
  It's not a donation. They pay for being the default search. They throw billions at Apple for the same, but nobody paints that as charity.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - x0x0 6y ago
    It's increasingly a charitable donation / obfuscation of their browser monopoly status since Mozilla has lost most of their leverage: Mozilla's marketshare has shrunk, and Google faces less and less competition for search. Why would Google pay for something they get for free, much less pay half a billion dollars. See the public numbers here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mozilla_Corporation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mozilla_Corporation under Combined income of Mozilla Foundation and Mozilla Corporation
    - foepys 6y ago
      > Why would Google pay for something they get for free For the same reason Microsoft saved Apple: to prevent anti-trust inquiries
- slezyr 6y ago
  No surprise. Poor man living rich man's live. They bought dead man's body - pocket, spend lots on dumb rebranding not long ago.
stu2b50 6y ago
They make 90% of their revenue from Google paying to have Google be the default web search on FF. A deal which is expiring in 2021 and hadn't yet been renewed.
- acqq 6y ago
  https://www.zdnet.com/article/sources-mozilla-expected-to-extend-its-google-search-deal/ https://www.zdnet.com/article/sources-mozilla-expected-to-ex... "Mozilla and Google are expected to extend their current search deal for another three years, multiple sources have told ZDNet." "Terms of the new deal were leaked to this reporter after Mozilla announced plans to lay off more than 250 employees on Wednesday". "Mozilla officials are expected to announce the search deal's extension later this fall, in November".
- deklerk 6y ago
  Where are you getting 90% from? AFAICT it's closer to 50% or 60% [1] [2]. And, note, that deal was only a 4 year deal from 2017-2021 [1]. It's not like a decades-old source of revenue that's dried up. And even though the deal is expiring, they've had deals before (yahoo etc), and will certainly have more in the future. 1: https://www.computerworld.com/article/3240008/mozillas-record-2016-revenue-funded-its-firefox-quantum-browser.html https://www.computerworld.com/article/3240008/mozillas-recor... 2: https://www.cnet.com/news/google-firefox-search-deal-gives-mozilla-more-money-to-push-privacy/ https://www.cnet.com/news/google-firefox-search-deal-gives-m...
  - stonogo 6y ago
    The 90% number probably comes from Mozilla's financial report, last released for 2018 [1]. "Approximately 91% and 93% of Mozilla’s royalty revenues were derived from these contracts for 2018 and 2017, respectively, with receivables from these contracts representing approximately 75% and 79% of the December 31, 2018 and 2017 outstanding receivables, respectively." Since for 2018 'Royalties' income was about 430 million, and reports are[2] that the deal was 300 million per year from Google, it's still a massive chunk of Mozilla's operating income, but you're right, it's not 90%. It's more like two thirds of their revenue coming from their market-dominant direct competitor. Also note that while this specific contract is a four-year deal, Google had been paying Mozilla millions even before then; in 2006 most of Mozilla's money came from Google (note the source is a now-deleted blog post from the current CEO of Mozilla)[3]. It is indeed a decades-old source of revenue, but it remains to be seen if it's dried up; word is they're renewing the contract, but we'll have to wait for Mozilla's next financial report to get more information. 1- https://assets.mozilla.net/annualreport/2018/mozilla-fdn-2018-short-form-final-0926.pdf https://assets.mozilla.net/annualreport/2018/mozilla-fdn-201... 2- http://allthingsd.com/20111222/google-will-pay-mozilla-almost-300m-per-year-in-search-deal-besting-microsoft-and-yahoo/ http://allthingsd.com/20111222/google-will-pay-mozilla-almos... 3- https://www.cnet.com/news/a-dangerous-conflict-of-interest-between-firefox-and-google/ https://www.cnet.com/news/a-dangerous-conflict-of-interest-b...

Does Mozilla not make enough money to sustain long term investments?

by kiba 6y ago

Does Mozilla not make enough money to sustain long term investments?

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

ChrisSD 6y ago

Mozilla Corp currently doesn't make much money at all, hence their problems. The majority of their funds come from a recurring Google donation, which has to be renewed every few years.

kryptiskt 6y ago
It's not a donation. They pay for being the default search. They throw billions at Apple for the same, but nobody paints that as charity.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- x0x0 6y ago
  It's increasingly a charitable donation / obfuscation of their browser monopoly status since Mozilla has lost most of their leverage: Mozilla's marketshare has shrunk, and Google faces less and less competition for search. Why would Google pay for something they get for free, much less pay half a billion dollars. See the public numbers here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mozilla_Corporation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mozilla_Corporation under Combined income of Mozilla Foundation and Mozilla Corporation
  - foepys 6y ago
    > Why would Google pay for something they get for free For the same reason Microsoft saved Apple: to prevent anti-trust inquiries
slezyr 6y ago
No surprise. Poor man living rich man's live. They bought dead man's body - pocket, spend lots on dumb rebranding not long ago.

stu2b50 6y ago

They make 90% of their revenue from Google paying to have Google be the default web search on FF. A deal which is expiring in 2021 and hadn't yet been renewed.

acqq 6y ago
https://www.zdnet.com/article/sources-mozilla-expected-to-extend-its-google-search-deal/ https://www.zdnet.com/article/sources-mozilla-expected-to-ex... "Mozilla and Google are expected to extend their current search deal for another three years, multiple sources have told ZDNet." "Terms of the new deal were leaked to this reporter after Mozilla announced plans to lay off more than 250 employees on Wednesday". "Mozilla officials are expected to announce the search deal's extension later this fall, in November".
deklerk 6y ago
Where are you getting 90% from? AFAICT it's closer to 50% or 60% [1] [2]. And, note, that deal was only a 4 year deal from 2017-2021 [1]. It's not like a decades-old source of revenue that's dried up. And even though the deal is expiring, they've had deals before (yahoo etc), and will certainly have more in the future. 1: https://www.computerworld.com/article/3240008/mozillas-record-2016-revenue-funded-its-firefox-quantum-browser.html https://www.computerworld.com/article/3240008/mozillas-recor... 2: https://www.cnet.com/news/google-firefox-search-deal-gives-mozilla-more-money-to-push-privacy/ https://www.cnet.com/news/google-firefox-search-deal-gives-m...
- stonogo 6y ago
  The 90% number probably comes from Mozilla's financial report, last released for 2018 [1]. "Approximately 91% and 93% of Mozilla’s royalty revenues were derived from these contracts for 2018 and 2017, respectively, with receivables from these contracts representing approximately 75% and 79% of the December 31, 2018 and 2017 outstanding receivables, respectively." Since for 2018 'Royalties' income was about 430 million, and reports are[2] that the deal was 300 million per year from Google, it's still a massive chunk of Mozilla's operating income, but you're right, it's not 90%. It's more like two thirds of their revenue coming from their market-dominant direct competitor. Also note that while this specific contract is a four-year deal, Google had been paying Mozilla millions even before then; in 2006 most of Mozilla's money came from Google (note the source is a now-deleted blog post from the current CEO of Mozilla)[3]. It is indeed a decades-old source of revenue, but it remains to be seen if it's dried up; word is they're renewing the contract, but we'll have to wait for Mozilla's next financial report to get more information. 1- https://assets.mozilla.net/annualreport/2018/mozilla-fdn-2018-short-form-final-0926.pdf https://assets.mozilla.net/annualreport/2018/mozilla-fdn-201... 2- http://allthingsd.com/20111222/google-will-pay-mozilla-almost-300m-per-year-in-search-deal-besting-microsoft-and-yahoo/ http://allthingsd.com/20111222/google-will-pay-mozilla-almos... 3- https://www.cnet.com/news/a-dangerous-conflict-of-interest-between-firefox-and-google/ https://www.cnet.com/news/a-dangerous-conflict-of-interest-b...