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Great- I think this will bring forth the root cause of the problem which is employer tied benefits and employer tied taxes. Right now there are entire business

Great- I think this will bring forth the root cause of the problem which is employer tied benefits and employer tied taxes. Right now there are entire business models based on avoiding taxes and benefits. You can have protections like min wage, sick leave, etc and still make it really simple os that evvery individual pays the entire tax (employer and employee payroll taxes) for every dollar they earn. It can be scaled based on annual amounts just like they are now. It'll be transparent and everyone will pay it.

ThrustVectoring 6y ago
The nominal burden of who "pays" employment-related taxes or benefits is completely separate from who the actual tax incidence falls on. Would you rather get paid $10k that you owe $1000 of taxes on, or get paid $9k with the $1k of taxes already withheld for you? Either way, the total cost of employing you remains the same for the company, and the take home pay after taxes remains the same.
- lawnchair_larry 6y ago
  Not quite, taxes are actually higher if you are self-employed. You have to pay SECA, which effectively includes the portion that your company would have paid otherwise (on top of the amount that they withhold and pay on your behalf).
  - ThrustVectoring 6y ago
    That's not taxes being "actually higher", that's taxes being paid in a way that increases the total cost of hiring someone without showing up anywhere on the pay stub of full-time W2 employees. Like, it changes the numbers to something like "$9k with $1k withheld and $1k of employer taxes" vs "$11k with $1k of income taxes and $1k of 'employer' taxes that you now have to pay"
ntsplnkv2 6y ago
They'll just move the goalposts. They'll say "no this is unfair to uber and workers." Then when you suggest the safety net they'll say " taxes are too high " or "they need to work harder for more money to provide for themselves."

ThrustVectoring 6y ago

The nominal burden of who "pays" employment-related taxes or benefits is completely separate from who the actual tax incidence falls on. Would you rather get paid $10k that you owe $1000 of taxes on, or get paid $9k with the $1k of taxes already withheld for you? Either way, the total cost of employing you remains the same for the company, and the take home pay after taxes remains the same.

lawnchair_larry 6y ago
Not quite, taxes are actually higher if you are self-employed. You have to pay SECA, which effectively includes the portion that your company would have paid otherwise (on top of the amount that they withhold and pay on your behalf).
- ThrustVectoring 6y ago
  That's not taxes being "actually higher", that's taxes being paid in a way that increases the total cost of hiring someone without showing up anywhere on the pay stub of full-time W2 employees. Like, it changes the numbers to something like "$9k with $1k withheld and $1k of employer taxes" vs "$11k with $1k of income taxes and $1k of 'employer' taxes that you now have to pay"

ntsplnkv2 6y ago

They'll just move the goalposts. They'll say "no this is unfair to uber and workers." Then when you suggest the safety net they'll say " taxes are too high " or "they need to work harder for more money to provide for themselves."