5 ms·

You seem to be misguided about the influence of politics on labor negotiations in Sweden. There is no mandate for a politician to interfere, it is entirely a th

by Jolter 6y ago

You seem to be misguided about the influence of politics on labor negotiations in Sweden. There is no mandate for a politician to interfere, it is entirely a thing between the two bargaining parties. That is, unless you can gather a political majority behind a major upheaval of the current law, which would have to happen after the next election because no such majority exists today.

waihtis 6y ago
Potentially true, my reflection point is Finland instead of Sweden. Unions over here are however thinly masked extensions of political parties, yes they operate somewhat independently but each political party has a 'favourite' union who they influence through unofficial channels.
- menybuvico 6y ago
  Sweden and Finland are pretty alike, but Sweden's system has a bit less political interference compared to how it's here in Finland. The ruling Social Democratic Party has strong ties with the unions though.
  - progre 6y ago
    They have traditional strong ties to one subset of the unions, the LO ones. But it's complex: LO is often openly critical of the (ruling) Social Democratic Party. At the same time a large chunk of the actual union members are voting for a different party, often one in opposition to the Social Democrats.
    - menybuvico 6y ago
      Yeah, my experiences with Swedish unions is definitely a bit dated, but I guess SD's growth is messing things up a bit, especially in LO?
      - progre 6y ago
        It is. The LO union members are the ones with the most to loose with a workforce surplus that comes with more immigration (really refugee asylum, traditional immigration is on about the same levels as ever). The Alliance (center-right, when it existed) recogniced this and made the traditionally left humanitarian stance their own. This backfired in a spectacular way when the alt-right wave swept the world. SD takes voters from both blocks.
- tokai 6y ago
  >each political party has a 'favourite' union who they influence through unofficial channels. its the other way around.
  - waihtis 6y ago
    Good correction - although I would say its more or less a two-way influence system.
guerrilla 6y ago
> That is, unless you can gather a political majority behind a major upheaval of the current law, wh But hasn't this already happened with recent reforms regarding the limiting of strike rights [1] and current LAS negotiations. [1] https://www.arbetaren.se/2019/06/19/riksdagen-klubbade-inskrankt-strejkratt/ https://www.arbetaren.se/2019/06/19/riksdagen-klubbade-inskr...
- Jolter 6y ago
  That's a pretty marginal change in the context of European labor practices. There is still an "obligation of peace" while a bargaining agreement is in place, for example. It will (initially at least) only affect sites where there is more than one union who are competing for the same category of members, which is not all that common.
  - guerrilla 6y ago
    > It will (initially at least) only affect sites where there is more than one union who are competing for the same category of members, which is not all that common. It is abstractly a huge deal and practically a huge deal for Hamnen, SAC, Brandmännens Riksförbund and other alternative unions because it excludes all competition among unions and channels all reform through the internal political workings of those unions like LO/Kommunal. As the a laywer in Arbetaren explained (and others have explained elsewhere) previously, it allows for company (i.e. "yellow") unions which is a realistic problem now considering Amazon is involved.

by Jolter 6y ago

waihtis 6y ago

Potentially true, my reflection point is Finland instead of Sweden. Unions over here are however thinly masked extensions of political parties, yes they operate somewhat independently but each political party has a 'favourite' union who they influence through unofficial channels.

menybuvico 6y ago
Sweden and Finland are pretty alike, but Sweden's system has a bit less political interference compared to how it's here in Finland. The ruling Social Democratic Party has strong ties with the unions though.
- progre 6y ago
  They have traditional strong ties to one subset of the unions, the LO ones. But it's complex: LO is often openly critical of the (ruling) Social Democratic Party. At the same time a large chunk of the actual union members are voting for a different party, often one in opposition to the Social Democrats.
  - menybuvico 6y ago
    Yeah, my experiences with Swedish unions is definitely a bit dated, but I guess SD's growth is messing things up a bit, especially in LO?
    - progre 6y ago
      It is. The LO union members are the ones with the most to loose with a workforce surplus that comes with more immigration (really refugee asylum, traditional immigration is on about the same levels as ever). The Alliance (center-right, when it existed) recogniced this and made the traditionally left humanitarian stance their own. This backfired in a spectacular way when the alt-right wave swept the world. SD takes voters from both blocks.
tokai 6y ago
>each political party has a 'favourite' union who they influence through unofficial channels. its the other way around.
- waihtis 6y ago
  Good correction - although I would say its more or less a two-way influence system.

guerrilla 6y ago

> That is, unless you can gather a political majority behind a major upheaval of the current law, wh But hasn't this already happened with recent reforms regarding the limiting of strike rights [1] and current LAS negotiations. [1] https://www.arbetaren.se/2019/06/19/riksdagen-klubbade-inskrankt-strejkratt/ https://www.arbetaren.se/2019/06/19/riksdagen-klubbade-inskr...

Jolter 6y ago
That's a pretty marginal change in the context of European labor practices. There is still an "obligation of peace" while a bargaining agreement is in place, for example. It will (initially at least) only affect sites where there is more than one union who are competing for the same category of members, which is not all that common.
- guerrilla 6y ago
  > It will (initially at least) only affect sites where there is more than one union who are competing for the same category of members, which is not all that common. It is abstractly a huge deal and practically a huge deal for Hamnen, SAC, Brandmännens Riksförbund and other alternative unions because it excludes all competition among unions and channels all reform through the internal political workings of those unions like LO/Kommunal. As the a laywer in Arbetaren explained (and others have explained elsewhere) previously, it allows for company (i.e. "yellow") unions which is a realistic problem now considering Amazon is involved.