5 ms·

The reason you can fly without any ID (even today - try it) is that feds cannot stop citizens from freely moving in the country (see multiple filings from TSA i

The reason you can fly without any ID (even today - try it) is that feds cannot stop citizens from freely moving in the country (see multiple filings from TSA in various cases, incl, for example, Gilmore v. Gonzales). They do not like acknowledging this but you can do it. The procedure is secret and they refuse to explain it (even to the court), but you can do it. i've done it just to see how it would go a few times. It works. You do need to press them on it a bit. This fee approach will not work for the same reason: it is an impediment to free movement (fee). You can read more here: https://papersplease.org/wp/2015/04/09/why-did-the-tsa-prevent-these-people-from-flying/ https://papersplease.org/wp/2015/04/09/why-did-the-tsa-preve...

rsync 6y ago
"The procedure is secret and they refuse to explain it (even to the court), but you can do it." I think you're overblowing this ... as it is neither secret nor unexplainable. Any ticket agent at any airport knows exactly how to process a frantic ( mom + 2 kids ) who forgot her ID at home and the flight leaves in 75 mins. The ticket agents, the security personnel and the gate personnel all know how to deal with (forgot ID at home).
- mynameisvlad 6y ago
  So... Please explain it then. Or link to a document from the TSA that explains it. Just because it's known by a lot of people doesn't mean it's not a secret. The ticket agent might not even know the full system, just what they have to do to get that frantic mom and 2 kids off their back.
  - rsync 6y ago
    "So... Please explain it then." Enter airport. Walk to departures agent of your airline and explain that you forgot your ID and there is no way that someone can bring it to you, or that you can retrieve it, in time to make the flight. You get extra screening and a specially marked boarding pass and you get on the plane with everyone else. My wife did this as recently as 12 months ago. SFO->MSP. YMMV. IANAL.
    - mynameisvlad 6y ago
      You know very well that that's not what "explain it" means. If you think the process isn't a secret, then find a document detailing the entire process, with specifics, end to end. What happens in the extra screening? Is it the same throughout the country? What might vary in the process (YMMV, after all), etc. You have a purely anecdotal account of what can happen at an airport that isn't even staffed by the TSA (https://www.flysfo.com/about-sfo/safety-security https://www.flysfo.com/about-sfo/safety-security). What everyone else is looking for is a specific, detailed, transparent description of the entire process.
- ipsin 6y ago
  There definitely is some opacity to the process, though. I've heard anecdotally of people showing up and saying "I chose not to bring ID", and... that can fail. I wouldn't be surprised if those are most of the ones who were actually denied no-ID travel.
- dmitrygr 6y ago
  TSA literally said it is a secret. They even agreed to show it to a judge only under seal. I literally linked to the case....
dylan604 6y ago
You need to be prepared for this by arriving to the airport with plenty of time. They will not be in a hurry to help someone with someone with no identification.
- roywiggins 6y ago
  I've passed through security without valid ID once or twice, and it amounted to the same level of checking that you get when your bag gets pulled out of the x-ray for something that looks off. Full pat-down, explosive-residue swab, and they took a look at the contents of my wallet (assorted credit, library cards and corporate ID). It wasn't a serious delay. Your milage may vary though, if things are already busy then you might be left waiting for a while. Best to err on the side of earlier. I wouldn't recommend it at all to people who are regularly profiled and hassled by TSA even with ID, of course...
  - pvg 6y ago
    You can also get the check mentioned in the article where they call somewhere and try to identify you with silly questions culled from public and private databases, not unlike some id checks you get from online banks. This can take forever as you're literally playing telephone.
- alasdair_ 6y ago
  >You need to be prepared for this by arriving to the airport with plenty of time. They will not be in a hurry to help someone with someone with no identification. I forgot my wallet (actually I'd packed it in my bag) and got through security in SFO without issue. They just had a secondary person come over and ask me several questions while looking directly into my eyes, then asked if I had anything with my name on it. I had an old prescription bottle (that I could have made with a laser printer) and that was plenty, other than them swabbing my hands.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
superkuh 6y ago
I flew without ID in Dec 2019 within the USA. I forgot both my wallet with my (non-REAL) ID, and my phone (which is a nokia dumb phone), at home and didn't realized till after the long car ride to the airport. There was no time to go back home. We tried flying anyway. They pulled me off to the side in the security line and called up someone they said was in washington DC. The local TSA said the DC people would do a search into my life and who I claimed to be. They then asked me a series of questions about buildings (ie, a church) near where I lived, the university I went to, my father's birthday, etc. I passed despite not knowing quite a bit about my own life and they let me on the plane. But with an escort through all the security screening section. It was nerve wracking the entire trip not knowing if I'd be able to fly home. The same process was repeated but again I answered to their satisfaction and was able to fly. I don't recommend doing this intentionally.

rsync 6y ago

"The procedure is secret and they refuse to explain it (even to the court), but you can do it." I think you're overblowing this ... as it is neither secret nor unexplainable. Any ticket agent at any airport knows exactly how to process a frantic ( mom + 2 kids ) who forgot her ID at home and the flight leaves in 75 mins. The ticket agents, the security personnel and the gate personnel all know how to deal with (forgot ID at home).

mynameisvlad 6y ago
So... Please explain it then. Or link to a document from the TSA that explains it. Just because it's known by a lot of people doesn't mean it's not a secret. The ticket agent might not even know the full system, just what they have to do to get that frantic mom and 2 kids off their back.
- rsync 6y ago
  "So... Please explain it then." Enter airport. Walk to departures agent of your airline and explain that you forgot your ID and there is no way that someone can bring it to you, or that you can retrieve it, in time to make the flight. You get extra screening and a specially marked boarding pass and you get on the plane with everyone else. My wife did this as recently as 12 months ago. SFO->MSP. YMMV. IANAL.
  - mynameisvlad 6y ago
    You know very well that that's not what "explain it" means. If you think the process isn't a secret, then find a document detailing the entire process, with specifics, end to end. What happens in the extra screening? Is it the same throughout the country? What might vary in the process (YMMV, after all), etc. You have a purely anecdotal account of what can happen at an airport that isn't even staffed by the TSA (https://www.flysfo.com/about-sfo/safety-security https://www.flysfo.com/about-sfo/safety-security). What everyone else is looking for is a specific, detailed, transparent description of the entire process.
ipsin 6y ago
There definitely is some opacity to the process, though. I've heard anecdotally of people showing up and saying "I chose not to bring ID", and... that can fail. I wouldn't be surprised if those are most of the ones who were actually denied no-ID travel.
dmitrygr 6y ago
TSA literally said it is a secret. They even agreed to show it to a judge only under seal. I literally linked to the case....

dylan604 6y ago

You need to be prepared for this by arriving to the airport with plenty of time. They will not be in a hurry to help someone with someone with no identification.

roywiggins 6y ago
I've passed through security without valid ID once or twice, and it amounted to the same level of checking that you get when your bag gets pulled out of the x-ray for something that looks off. Full pat-down, explosive-residue swab, and they took a look at the contents of my wallet (assorted credit, library cards and corporate ID). It wasn't a serious delay. Your milage may vary though, if things are already busy then you might be left waiting for a while. Best to err on the side of earlier. I wouldn't recommend it at all to people who are regularly profiled and hassled by TSA even with ID, of course...
- pvg 6y ago
  You can also get the check mentioned in the article where they call somewhere and try to identify you with silly questions culled from public and private databases, not unlike some id checks you get from online banks. This can take forever as you're literally playing telephone.
alasdair_ 6y ago
>You need to be prepared for this by arriving to the airport with plenty of time. They will not be in a hurry to help someone with someone with no identification. I forgot my wallet (actually I'd packed it in my bag) and got through security in SFO without issue. They just had a secondary person come over and ask me several questions while looking directly into my eyes, then asked if I had anything with my name on it. I had an old prescription bottle (that I could have made with a laser printer) and that was plenty, other than them swabbing my hands.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]

superkuh 6y ago

I flew without ID in Dec 2019 within the USA. I forgot both my wallet with my (non-REAL) ID, and my phone (which is a nokia dumb phone), at home and didn't realized till after the long car ride to the airport. There was no time to go back home. We tried flying anyway. They pulled me off to the side in the security line and called up someone they said was in washington DC. The local TSA said the DC people would do a search into my life and who I claimed to be. They then asked me a series of questions about buildings (ie, a church) near where I lived, the university I went to, my father's birthday, etc. I passed despite not knowing quite a bit about my own life and they let me on the plane. But with an escort through all the security screening section. It was nerve wracking the entire trip not knowing if I'd be able to fly home. The same process was repeated but again I answered to their satisfaction and was able to fly. I don't recommend doing this intentionally.