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Ah, yes, because it's impossible to store a contact list client-side. Or to encrypt arbitrary data like that to store server-side! Glad Moxie's looking out for
by ddevault 6y ago
Ah, yes, because it's impossible to store a contact list client-side. Or to encrypt arbitrary data like that to store server-side! Glad Moxie's looking out for us.
- tptacek 6y agoPlease point to the mainstream secure messenger other than Signal that doesn't store a database of contacts serverside.
- ddevault 6y agohttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism
- tptacek 6y agoI don't understand. You just claimed that it was easy for messengers to store contact databases clientside. Of course, it isn't, or everyone would. Asking you to provide evidence for your argument isn't "whataboutism". Not only that, but you're commenting on a thread about Signal's phone number requirement. You can't inject snark into a thread and then assume some kind of moral high ground when you faceplant.
- ddevault 6y agoYou've got to be kidding me. The ability to store data on your device is a basic requirement of a software environment which is provided by all platforms. I'd forgive someone for not understanding that arbitrary data can be encrypted, but you claim to have some expertise in cryptography so you don't get a pass there. Someone like OWS, the developers of a privacy app, certainly don't get a pass. It is possible, and it is easy, and you know this.
- tptacek 6y agoSupport your claim with evidence, like I asked earlier. Not axiomatically; with an example of a mainstream messenger other than Signal that doesn't store a database of contacts serverside. For example: do either of the two messengers you formerly recommended manage to avoid this problem? After all, it's apparently super simple to solve this. Look at where this left Tox.
- ddevault 6y ago>Not axiomatically; with an example of a mainstream messenger I don't have to provide the specific sort of evidence you're asking for in order to be right. I could write up a small script demonstrating the approach I'm talking about here, but it's rather obvious and based on simple, well-understood axioms. Unless you reject the axioms that (1) contact lists are representible as data, (2) applications can store data on your device, and (3) that data can be encrypted? If you're just going to argue in bad faith then you can take it elsewhere, I'm not interested. Based on my past experiences with you, I don't have high hopes. >do either of the two messengers you formerly recommended Recommandations which have been retracted; I decline to answer.
- tptacek 6y agoYou did not retract them. You ghost edited them out of your post to save face. A retraction would be useful, and you should add one.
- ddevault 6y agoYou might have preferred it if I had written up a retraction in the article itself, but nevertheless, the statement was removed over 2 years ago and has no bearing on the present-day discussion. Stop being a bully and leave me alone! I am tired of your harassment.
- Shared404 6y ago> Support your claim with evidence, like I asked earlier. You asked for specifically mainstream messengers. Cutting out mainstream, I can think of Tox and Jami off the top of my head. Update 0: remove Tox, as you mention it in your comment. Update 1: add Tox back in because your reply is about it, and I made edit 0 before seeing your reply.
- dingaling 6y agoTake your SIM and install it in a clean phone. Install WhatsApp and verify the account. Notice that when you open WhatsApp, only your group memberships are populated. Individual contacts are not, because they are held on the original device.