7 ms·

Sorry to hear you are struggling with internet access, but I don't see how the actions of India create legal precedence in Belarus?

keenmaster 6y ago
He's being sardonic. Assad, Putin, Lukashenko, Modi, Bolsonaro, Duterte...they all use pseudo-legalistic justifications for authoritarian action. Assad in particular went as far as cataloging thousands of his torture victims to give an official veneer to the circumstances of their death. This is even though it seems insane to record evidence of one's own gruesome crimes of genocide. https://www.hrw.org/report/2015/12/16/if-dead-could-speak/mass-deaths-and-torture-syrias-detention-facilities https://www.hrw.org/report/2015/12/16/if-dead-could-speak/ma...
- beepboopbeep 6y ago
  >Assad, Putin, Lukashenko, Modi, Bolsonaro, Duterte, Trump...they all use pseudo-legalistic justifications for authoritarian action
  - MichaelApproved 6y ago
    You’re getting down voted for including Trump but his recent use of Federal officers to police the streets of Portland and his attempts to delay the November vote show he is in the same category.
  - m0zg 6y ago
    Except of course in the real world Trump resisted using federal forces until rioters started attacking federal property and Portland decided to let it burn. Can we here concede that burning a federal courthouse is not OK? He's still not using the federal forces: don't interfere when your opponent is making a mistake. The rioters and "police defunders" are making an amazingly powerful case for his re-election.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
JumpCrisscross 6y ago
> I don't see how the actions of India create legal precedence in Belarus? It's a precedent for the world ignoring such actions.
- actuator 6y ago
  I honestly don't think any country in the world cares at this point. There are far worse things world has ignored, I hardly think this needed a precedent.
  - PeterisP 6y ago
    There's a saying that the good always prevails, so whoever wins is the good side. This is a fight that the people of Belarus have to win right there on the ground in Belarus, because in cases like this the world will just accept the de facto winner as legitimate and work with them, whoever they may be. Any atrocities involved will be condemned with loud proclamations and no real consequence.
- kube-system 6y ago
  FWIW, it hasn't been ignored; the US State Department has condemned the restrictions in Kashmir.
  - keenmaster 6y ago
    There are a wide range of policy tools that the U.S. failed to use with regards to Kashmir and the oppression of Muslims in India, up to and including sanctions. You can disagree on the efficacy of any particular policy tool, but something with economic and/or diplomatic consequences must be done. Academic research has shown that even the threat of sanctions can help. I'm not holding my breath that Trump will do anything to improve the situation. He has a very warm relationship with Modi. We should not wait for the arc of history to prove strongmen wrong. We owe it to the oppressed peoples of the world to advocate for non-militaristic measures which help reduce or eliminate their oppression. Some self-doubt is healthy, and the West has done a lot of bad things in the past. We can't let that self-doubt paralyze our foreign policy though. The world would devolve into a worse place. Obama misused MLK's belief on the arc of history (bending towards justice) to justify what is increasingly looking like a terrible foreign policy regime (hands off on Russia --->Syrian genocide--->refugees flooding Europe--->alt-right backlash and Brexit--->Crimea --->alt-right worldwide--->widespread election manipulation--->shaky NATO and EU--->hyperventilating Eastern Europe--->emboldened strongmen--->??? But wait, there's more! Do the claims that sanctions can cause WWIII seem hollow now? Is it becoming clear to everyone that Russian imperialism and Iranian imperialism need just as much scrutiny and backlash as Western imperialism?). On that note, sanctions on Belarus are very limited. Here's the thing with sanctions: sanctions on one bad actor can be dodged if there are other, larger bad actors who aren't being put in their place. However, systematic sanctions, against all major human rights abusers, would be really hard to dodge. That is especially if we give them a well-defined route out of the sanctions regime, where sanctions are gradually relaxed until the abuses are stopped. “A man dies when he refuses to stand up for that which is right. A man dies when he refuses to stand up for justice. A man dies when he refuses to take a stand for that which is true.” — Dr. Martin Luther King Jr.
Florin_Andrei 6y ago
> I don't see how the actions of India create legal precedence in Belarus? The person is frustrated and that part of the comment is sarcastic. I think it's understandable given the context.

keenmaster 6y ago

He's being sardonic. Assad, Putin, Lukashenko, Modi, Bolsonaro, Duterte...they all use pseudo-legalistic justifications for authoritarian action. Assad in particular went as far as cataloging thousands of his torture victims to give an official veneer to the circumstances of their death. This is even though it seems insane to record evidence of one's own gruesome crimes of genocide. https://www.hrw.org/report/2015/12/16/if-dead-could-speak/mass-deaths-and-torture-syrias-detention-facilities https://www.hrw.org/report/2015/12/16/if-dead-could-speak/ma...

beepboopbeep 6y ago
>Assad, Putin, Lukashenko, Modi, Bolsonaro, Duterte, Trump...they all use pseudo-legalistic justifications for authoritarian action
- MichaelApproved 6y ago
  You’re getting down voted for including Trump but his recent use of Federal officers to police the streets of Portland and his attempts to delay the November vote show he is in the same category.
- m0zg 6y ago
  Except of course in the real world Trump resisted using federal forces until rioters started attacking federal property and Portland decided to let it burn. Can we here concede that burning a federal courthouse is not OK? He's still not using the federal forces: don't interfere when your opponent is making a mistake. The rioters and "police defunders" are making an amazingly powerful case for his re-election.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]

JumpCrisscross 6y ago

> I don't see how the actions of India create legal precedence in Belarus? It's a precedent for the world ignoring such actions.

actuator 6y ago
I honestly don't think any country in the world cares at this point. There are far worse things world has ignored, I hardly think this needed a precedent.
- PeterisP 6y ago
  There's a saying that the good always prevails, so whoever wins is the good side. This is a fight that the people of Belarus have to win right there on the ground in Belarus, because in cases like this the world will just accept the de facto winner as legitimate and work with them, whoever they may be. Any atrocities involved will be condemned with loud proclamations and no real consequence.
kube-system 6y ago
FWIW, it hasn't been ignored; the US State Department has condemned the restrictions in Kashmir.
- keenmaster 6y ago
  There are a wide range of policy tools that the U.S. failed to use with regards to Kashmir and the oppression of Muslims in India, up to and including sanctions. You can disagree on the efficacy of any particular policy tool, but something with economic and/or diplomatic consequences must be done. Academic research has shown that even the threat of sanctions can help. I'm not holding my breath that Trump will do anything to improve the situation. He has a very warm relationship with Modi. We should not wait for the arc of history to prove strongmen wrong. We owe it to the oppressed peoples of the world to advocate for non-militaristic measures which help reduce or eliminate their oppression. Some self-doubt is healthy, and the West has done a lot of bad things in the past. We can't let that self-doubt paralyze our foreign policy though. The world would devolve into a worse place. Obama misused MLK's belief on the arc of history (bending towards justice) to justify what is increasingly looking like a terrible foreign policy regime (hands off on Russia --->Syrian genocide--->refugees flooding Europe--->alt-right backlash and Brexit--->Crimea --->alt-right worldwide--->widespread election manipulation--->shaky NATO and EU--->hyperventilating Eastern Europe--->emboldened strongmen--->??? But wait, there's more! Do the claims that sanctions can cause WWIII seem hollow now? Is it becoming clear to everyone that Russian imperialism and Iranian imperialism need just as much scrutiny and backlash as Western imperialism?). On that note, sanctions on Belarus are very limited. Here's the thing with sanctions: sanctions on one bad actor can be dodged if there are other, larger bad actors who aren't being put in their place. However, systematic sanctions, against all major human rights abusers, would be really hard to dodge. That is especially if we give them a well-defined route out of the sanctions regime, where sanctions are gradually relaxed until the abuses are stopped. “A man dies when he refuses to stand up for that which is right. A man dies when he refuses to stand up for justice. A man dies when he refuses to take a stand for that which is true.” — Dr. Martin Luther King Jr.

Florin_Andrei 6y ago

> I don't see how the actions of India create legal precedence in Belarus? The person is frustrated and that part of the comment is sarcastic. I think it's understandable given the context.