5 ms·

OK, let's play this game: You are now fully in control of Mozilla - projects, finances, it's all on you. How would you turn Firefox into a browser with signific

OK, let's play this game: You are now fully in control of Mozilla - projects, finances, it's all on you. How would you turn Firefox into a browser with significant market share in an increasingly mobile world where two competitors control default applications and most users newer change any defaults?

CameronNemo 6y ago
I like this question. Not as a way to argue, but as actual productive discussion. I would work with the LineageOS, Replicant, Ubuntu Touch, postmarketOS, microG, Fairphone, Pinephone, etc. folks to integrate the Gecko engine as much as possible into their offerings. Or at least offer flavors that do so, or prompts to select a browser engine on first boot. If necessary and economical I would pay LOS to ship Firefox by default.
- ac29 6y ago
  Even if you got 100% of those projects committed to integrating Mozilla technology, you'd have a infinitesimal fraction of the browser market. Furthermore, those users are already probably fairly anti-Google, so it would be preaching to the converted.
  - CameronNemo 6y ago
    You have to start somewhere... and many LOS users do not mind Google. They just want an up to date ROM.
- takluyver 6y ago
  Can I play? You get pushback from most of those projects because Chrome is the 'just works' option for the mobile web - no-one tests their websites with Firefox mobile. Some of them are persuaded on principle (like Replicant), some want money, some refuse outright. We'll say you agree a $500k /yr deal for Firefox as the default in Lineage. You still have a tiny fraction of the mobile browser market, because all those platforms together are a drop in the Android & iOS ocean.
  - qu4z-2 6y ago
    I'm not entirely convinced users of microG put "just works" first and foremost...
  - CameronNemo 6y ago
    IME Firefox on Android works well for most, if not all, of the websites I have visited. Regarding the tiny drop comment: you have to start somewhere. Why not with the users who have the most tolerance and technical skills?
jacquesm 6y ago
I would put the user first, make privacy the #1 priority, make it plain to the EU that FireFox is the only browser that can make that guarantee and long term stand by it and apply for subsidy as well as promotion by the EU and/or anti-trust action against Google, Microsoft and Apple for not giving the users of their devices the option to install/run FireFox right out of the gate. Ad blocking and tracker blocking would be a central item built into the browser from the get-go. I'd get rid of any and all telemetry unless explicitly opted-in to by the user. I'd make sure that updates are going to be limited to security issues only and that any other feature changes or additions would always be optional rather than forced. I'd ax each and every product that is not in line with that mission. Rust would be welcome to stay since it is now part of the future of the browser, but I'd spin it out as a separate entity with its own income stream based on a trademark of the name and set up a foundation around that. The Rustaceans would be encouraged to create their own governance structure and Mozilla would be just another user of that product. Oh, and I'd rename the company to FireFox Brower Inc. As for mobile, I'm sure that there is room for firefox on mobile but first you'd have to convince Apple and Google that they are on the wrong path, a distraction that likely would not lead to a win in appreciable time.
- calcifer 6y ago
  > I'd get rid of any and all telemetry > feature changes or additions would always be optional > Ignore mobile So... You are increasing costs ("everything optional"), reducing visibility ("no default telemetry") and ignoring the largest and fastest growing market (mobile). How is your FireFox Browser Inc. making money? You also didn't respond to my question at all - how is any of this supposed to increase market share?
  - SkyMarshal 6y ago
    First step in increasing market share is to stop losing market share. Jacquesm’s strategy owns the market for privacy-prioritizing customers, creating a market share floor. It may be small but it’s a solid, committed base. Then you build on it. Corporate and government data security is a related area that a strong privacy-preserving product and team with world class privacy/crypto/security expertise could expand into, especially in places like the EU and India that need a neutral and trustworthy alternative to Chrome-based and Safari-based products. Maybe even the US given the new “Clean Path” initiative. There are opportunities but you have to stop the bleeding first. I think Jacquesm’s Apple-like strategy of focusing on the most important, already-market-proven product and saying No to most everything else is the best shot at that.

CameronNemo 6y ago

I like this question. Not as a way to argue, but as actual productive discussion. I would work with the LineageOS, Replicant, Ubuntu Touch, postmarketOS, microG, Fairphone, Pinephone, etc. folks to integrate the Gecko engine as much as possible into their offerings. Or at least offer flavors that do so, or prompts to select a browser engine on first boot. If necessary and economical I would pay LOS to ship Firefox by default.

ac29 6y ago
Even if you got 100% of those projects committed to integrating Mozilla technology, you'd have a infinitesimal fraction of the browser market. Furthermore, those users are already probably fairly anti-Google, so it would be preaching to the converted.
- CameronNemo 6y ago
  You have to start somewhere... and many LOS users do not mind Google. They just want an up to date ROM.
takluyver 6y ago
Can I play? You get pushback from most of those projects because Chrome is the 'just works' option for the mobile web - no-one tests their websites with Firefox mobile. Some of them are persuaded on principle (like Replicant), some want money, some refuse outright. We'll say you agree a $500k /yr deal for Firefox as the default in Lineage. You still have a tiny fraction of the mobile browser market, because all those platforms together are a drop in the Android & iOS ocean.
- qu4z-2 6y ago
  I'm not entirely convinced users of microG put "just works" first and foremost...
- CameronNemo 6y ago
  IME Firefox on Android works well for most, if not all, of the websites I have visited. Regarding the tiny drop comment: you have to start somewhere. Why not with the users who have the most tolerance and technical skills?

jacquesm 6y ago

I would put the user first, make privacy the #1 priority, make it plain to the EU that FireFox is the only browser that can make that guarantee and long term stand by it and apply for subsidy as well as promotion by the EU and/or anti-trust action against Google, Microsoft and Apple for not giving the users of their devices the option to install/run FireFox right out of the gate. Ad blocking and tracker blocking would be a central item built into the browser from the get-go. I'd get rid of any and all telemetry unless explicitly opted-in to by the user. I'd make sure that updates are going to be limited to security issues only and that any other feature changes or additions would always be optional rather than forced. I'd ax each and every product that is not in line with that mission. Rust would be welcome to stay since it is now part of the future of the browser, but I'd spin it out as a separate entity with its own income stream based on a trademark of the name and set up a foundation around that. The Rustaceans would be encouraged to create their own governance structure and Mozilla would be just another user of that product. Oh, and I'd rename the company to FireFox Brower Inc. As for mobile, I'm sure that there is room for firefox on mobile but first you'd have to convince Apple and Google that they are on the wrong path, a distraction that likely would not lead to a win in appreciable time.

calcifer 6y ago
> I'd get rid of any and all telemetry > feature changes or additions would always be optional > Ignore mobile So... You are increasing costs ("everything optional"), reducing visibility ("no default telemetry") and ignoring the largest and fastest growing market (mobile). How is your FireFox Browser Inc. making money? You also didn't respond to my question at all - how is any of this supposed to increase market share?
- SkyMarshal 6y ago
  First step in increasing market share is to stop losing market share. Jacquesm’s strategy owns the market for privacy-prioritizing customers, creating a market share floor. It may be small but it’s a solid, committed base. Then you build on it. Corporate and government data security is a related area that a strong privacy-preserving product and team with world class privacy/crypto/security expertise could expand into, especially in places like the EU and India that need a neutral and trustworthy alternative to Chrome-based and Safari-based products. Maybe even the US given the new “Clean Path” initiative. There are opportunities but you have to stop the bleeding first. I think Jacquesm’s Apple-like strategy of focusing on the most important, already-market-proven product and saying No to most everything else is the best shot at that.