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Well, I want to use products from companies that I support. Mozilla is simply pushing too much politics that I strongly disagree with so I cannot support them.

Well, I want to use products from companies that I support. Mozilla is simply pushing too much politics that I strongly disagree with so I cannot support them. Brave is more private and respecting of the user, without the politics. It's all whats good with Mozilla leaving out the bad part. We could have had that in Mozilla today, but because virtue signaling they had to fire Brendan. This was probably the nail that lead to the coffin for Mozilla.

jamienicol 6y ago
"Firing Eich because of his political views is virtue signalling. I don't use Firefox because of Mozilla's political views."
- ecmascript 6y ago
  Yes, do you have something to say or do you just like to quote me? I dislike companies that push a political agenda when the product or service itself has little to do with it. Privacy politics is fine, since that is a core part of Mozilla and Firefox and is very neutral since everyone can enjoy privacy. It is also part of the browsing experience. But pushing stuff like "white privilege" is just pushing away users like me. I use Brave, which is a company founded by Brendan and they don't push anti gay marriage politics on me even if that is what they may support. I just don't want that in my browser, it makes it a shitty experience. I don't understand what's hard to understand about that. I am also a web developer, so pissing me off will just result in me not testing the website in Firefox unless my users specifically requests it.
  - stnmtn 6y ago
    Is gay marriage anti-marriage to you?
  - AlexandrB 6y ago
    > I just don't want that in my browser, it makes it a shitty experience. How? If you don't care about politics, why would the politics of the organization running the browser affect your experience? Aren't you therefore virtue signalling (in this case for maximal free speech) by not using Firefox for political reasons? You haven't mentioned any product features/decisions made as a result of Mozilla's "virtue signalling" that affected the day-to-day experience of using Firefox.
    - ecmascript 6y ago
      Thanks for actually writing an answer instead of just circle-jerking and spamming the downvote button. It's more about the features they don't implement, presumably because their focus is elsewhere. The biggest and most obvious feature is PWA support that is (still) lacking to this day which is very bad. They don't follow the standards in picture-in-picture, messing up the user experience somewhat. Minor things like using the wrong default algos for svg filters. I've had many issues with SVG support in Firefox. The fact that Firefox is still laggier in a lot of different scenarios, but mostly games for me. In online fast pace games it makes the experience completely unplayable. Try https://agor.io https://agor.io in firefox and then swtich to Brave for example. It lags in firefox, at least on linux. These are some of the things I could think of right now, but over time I've found many things that I find frustrating with Firefox. Then reading that they purchased pocket, a service which basically no one is using afaik seems like simply bad business. They also claim to value privacy but there wasn't long ago since someone discovered that they send data to google even in private browsing. Brave was the only browser that didn't send any privacy-invading requests. I think most of these things is due to a lack of commitment to the tech and a focus that has been on something else, namely politics. (Couldn't answer earlier since HN disallows posting more than 4 comments per hour..)
  - jamienicol 6y ago
    Just pointing out the hypocrisy of your statements. Seems like it's only "virtue signalling" when you disagree with the virtues.
jccalhoun 6y ago
My reason for using Firefox and never trying Brave is the same: I strongly disagree with Brendan Eich's politics. If using Brave means Brendan Eich profits from it then I'll never use it.

jamienicol 6y ago

"Firing Eich because of his political views is virtue signalling. I don't use Firefox because of Mozilla's political views."

ecmascript 6y ago
Yes, do you have something to say or do you just like to quote me? I dislike companies that push a political agenda when the product or service itself has little to do with it. Privacy politics is fine, since that is a core part of Mozilla and Firefox and is very neutral since everyone can enjoy privacy. It is also part of the browsing experience. But pushing stuff like "white privilege" is just pushing away users like me. I use Brave, which is a company founded by Brendan and they don't push anti gay marriage politics on me even if that is what they may support. I just don't want that in my browser, it makes it a shitty experience. I don't understand what's hard to understand about that. I am also a web developer, so pissing me off will just result in me not testing the website in Firefox unless my users specifically requests it.
- stnmtn 6y ago
  Is gay marriage anti-marriage to you?
- AlexandrB 6y ago
  > I just don't want that in my browser, it makes it a shitty experience. How? If you don't care about politics, why would the politics of the organization running the browser affect your experience? Aren't you therefore virtue signalling (in this case for maximal free speech) by not using Firefox for political reasons? You haven't mentioned any product features/decisions made as a result of Mozilla's "virtue signalling" that affected the day-to-day experience of using Firefox.
  - ecmascript 6y ago
    Thanks for actually writing an answer instead of just circle-jerking and spamming the downvote button. It's more about the features they don't implement, presumably because their focus is elsewhere. The biggest and most obvious feature is PWA support that is (still) lacking to this day which is very bad. They don't follow the standards in picture-in-picture, messing up the user experience somewhat. Minor things like using the wrong default algos for svg filters. I've had many issues with SVG support in Firefox. The fact that Firefox is still laggier in a lot of different scenarios, but mostly games for me. In online fast pace games it makes the experience completely unplayable. Try https://agor.io https://agor.io in firefox and then swtich to Brave for example. It lags in firefox, at least on linux. These are some of the things I could think of right now, but over time I've found many things that I find frustrating with Firefox. Then reading that they purchased pocket, a service which basically no one is using afaik seems like simply bad business. They also claim to value privacy but there wasn't long ago since someone discovered that they send data to google even in private browsing. Brave was the only browser that didn't send any privacy-invading requests. I think most of these things is due to a lack of commitment to the tech and a focus that has been on something else, namely politics. (Couldn't answer earlier since HN disallows posting more than 4 comments per hour..)
- jamienicol 6y ago
  Just pointing out the hypocrisy of your statements. Seems like it's only "virtue signalling" when you disagree with the virtues.

jccalhoun 6y ago

My reason for using Firefox and never trying Brave is the same: I strongly disagree with Brendan Eich's politics. If using Brave means Brendan Eich profits from it then I'll never use it.