3 ms·

What autonomy would Uber need to provide?

sangnoir 6y ago
One part of the "ABC test"[1] used to check the "contractorness" under law requires that "...the worker is free from the control and direction of the hiring entity in connection with the performance of the work..." - Uber controls every minute of drivers work time, so this will be a high hurdle to clear. Part B is similarly challenging, because it requires that the contractor & the work they are doing not be in the same line of business as hiring entity 1. https://www.californiaemploymentlawreport.com/2019/03/understanding-the-abc-test-for-independent-contractors-in-california/ https://www.californiaemploymentlawreport.com/2019/03/unders...
fastball 6y ago
Yes I would like to know this too. I know a guy that drives more than full-time for Uber (50+ hours pw). I have a friend that drives approximately 8 hours pw for Uber. How are drivers not choosing their own hours, exactly? That seems to be exactly what they are doing. And when I say "Uber", I actually mean Uber/Lyft. And obviously in some parts of the US there are other apps and drivers use those too.
- hypersoar 6y ago
  Being an independent contractor is about more than "choosing your own hours". you can be an employee and have flexible hours. You can be a contractor and have fixed hours. There are plenty of examples of both in the tech industry.
  - fastball 6y ago
    Hmm, maybe I just don't know enough people, but I don't know any employee (with benefits and such) that can just stop working for their company for 12 months with no prior notice, and then pick it back up whenever. And infinite variations on that refrain. I also don't know any employee who gets paid money by the customer to do a job, of which a small portion is taken by the company. For every "employee" I know, it works in exactly the opposite way.
    - ClumsyPilot 6y ago
      Uber gets paid, not the driver. The money does not drop directly into the driver's bank account. The driver cannot decide to change his rate or charge extra if the customer pukes in the car. And besides, Getting a cut of your sales and it's called commission. Independence goes much further - can the driver assign someone else to do the job?
      - fastball 6y ago
        Uber collects the payment. But it belongs to the driver. Uber then takes a fraction of it. As with any other marketplace/platform: Amazon, Patreon, App Stores, Twitch, Steam, etc. Stripe collects payments for me when I sell my app. The money does not drop directly into my bank account. And I don't think Uber has any problem with drivers hiring other people to drive their car and do Uber for them. The people that take an issue with that are the municipalities that want to require background checks, etc. for drivers.
        sudosysgen 6y ago
        Uber doesn't tell the driver how much it's charging the customer, takes an arbitrary cut, and doesn't let you decide of the price, exactly unlike the Apple App store, Amazon, Patreon, and Steam. There are also more reasons why they are employees, but these are material to your claims.
      - saurik 6y ago
        A quick search is showing me a ton of answers on Quora of being emphatically stating that Uber actively allows you to hire people to drive your car for you, as long as you can show they are insured to do so: the money goes to you, to the one parent account, so you get to decide how to pay your subcontractors; supposedly you can even register as a corporation?

One part of the "ABC test"[1] used to check the "contractorness" under law requires that "...the worker is free from the control and direction of the hiring entity in connection with the performance of the work..." - Uber controls every minute of drivers work time, so this will be a high hurdle to clear. Part B is similarly challenging, because it requires that the contractor & the work they are doing not be in the same line of business as hiring entity 1. https://www.californiaemploymentlawreport.com/2019/03/understanding-the-abc-test-for-independent-contractors-in-california/ https://www.californiaemploymentlawreport.com/2019/03/unders...

fastball 6y ago

Yes I would like to know this too. I know a guy that drives more than full-time for Uber (50+ hours pw). I have a friend that drives approximately 8 hours pw for Uber. How are drivers not choosing their own hours, exactly? That seems to be exactly what they are doing. And when I say "Uber", I actually mean Uber/Lyft. And obviously in some parts of the US there are other apps and drivers use those too.

hypersoar 6y ago
Being an independent contractor is about more than "choosing your own hours". you can be an employee and have flexible hours. You can be a contractor and have fixed hours. There are plenty of examples of both in the tech industry.
- fastball 6y ago
  Hmm, maybe I just don't know enough people, but I don't know any employee (with benefits and such) that can just stop working for their company for 12 months with no prior notice, and then pick it back up whenever. And infinite variations on that refrain. I also don't know any employee who gets paid money by the customer to do a job, of which a small portion is taken by the company. For every "employee" I know, it works in exactly the opposite way.
  - ClumsyPilot 6y ago
    Uber gets paid, not the driver. The money does not drop directly into the driver's bank account. The driver cannot decide to change his rate or charge extra if the customer pukes in the car. And besides, Getting a cut of your sales and it's called commission. Independence goes much further - can the driver assign someone else to do the job?
    - fastball 6y ago
      Uber collects the payment. But it belongs to the driver. Uber then takes a fraction of it. As with any other marketplace/platform: Amazon, Patreon, App Stores, Twitch, Steam, etc. Stripe collects payments for me when I sell my app. The money does not drop directly into my bank account. And I don't think Uber has any problem with drivers hiring other people to drive their car and do Uber for them. The people that take an issue with that are the municipalities that want to require background checks, etc. for drivers.
      - sudosysgen 6y ago
        Uber doesn't tell the driver how much it's charging the customer, takes an arbitrary cut, and doesn't let you decide of the price, exactly unlike the Apple App store, Amazon, Patreon, and Steam. There are also more reasons why they are employees, but these are material to your claims.
    - saurik 6y ago
      A quick search is showing me a ton of answers on Quora of being emphatically stating that Uber actively allows you to hire people to drive your car for you, as long as you can show they are insured to do so: the money goes to you, to the one parent account, so you get to decide how to pay your subcontractors; supposedly you can even register as a corporation?