5 ms·

Taxes are the cost of civilization - of being able to deal with other people without resorting to violence every time. Perhaps one day we'll be able to do that

by jmcqk6 6y ago

Taxes are the cost of civilization - of being able to deal with other people without resorting to violence every time. Perhaps one day we'll be able to do that without a monopolistic entity enforcing the rules, but it's very clear that time is not now. I personally don't have any problems paying taxes. I can get fussy about some of the details, but I can recognize the necessity of some organization performing these duties.

feralimal 6y ago
Great - can you pay me some money too? I'll call it a tax if it will help..
- jmcqk6 6y ago
  Obviously you think this is a clever reply, but it isn't. Between this and your parent post, all you're really doing is demonstrating that you have no idea how civilization works. Perhaps you have some idea of how you think things ought to work instead, but that's true of basically everyone. Clearly you perceive no value from taxes and deeply resent that you have to pay them in the first place. And hell, you might even do well for yourself out in the wilderness alone, independent from everyone else. But since you're posting here, that is obviously not your current situation. So if you want to be a part of civilization, you need to pay your dues just like everyone else. And if you don't like it, at least you have the possibility of going something about it yourself, if you can convince enough other people that you're right.
  - feralimal 6y ago
    You don't have a choice about being a part of civilisation and whether you pay taxes or not. No choice. But congratulations, you have made yourself feel as if you did and you're happy to go with it. I guess you walk out the door, satisfied at the way your money is spent, the roads, armies, education, etc, etc - just as you would have chosen for yourself!
    - jmcqk6 6y ago
      Just because I'm happy to pay taxes doesn't mean that I'm happy with the ways that money is spent. But I can recognize the inherent need for _some_ entity to serve in this function, and I'm glad that I have one that I can participant in. There is literally no citizen in the world that is completely happy with their country. That is part of being human. Because our views are so diverse, it's impossible to form large groups of people without those types of disagreements. I didn't get a choice about being born, either, but that doesn't mean I'm not going to do what I can with what I have instead of pining for a reality that will never exist.
      - feralimal 6y ago
        You participate once every 5 years in voting for one of 2 meaningful options on a list of ~5-15 issues. No one is happy with that choice. Then, say 50% of the populace vote, 25% get the person who they voted for in. So the 25% (who do not feel fully represented) get to rule over the other 75% who know they are not represented. Basically we all pay taxes into a system that no one feels happy about. And when you think about it, it isn't about what's right - it comes down to who has the force. Its a mafioso monetary extraction system, that indoctrinates its victims. 'Stockholm Syndrome' is the psychological term for when you love your captor; most people who support the government system suffer with this. As a group of people our views are diverse. That's good, right? Large groups of people are hard to manage. So don't manage them. I don't seek to manage other people's affairs. Government is the solution to a problem that doesn't exist - managing lots of people. People should be self-managing. PS There's a difference between jumping to the defence of a system that no one is happy with, and finding a way to survive in a system that is collectivising and dehumanising. In supporting the system as you do, you are literally a turkey voting for Christmas. Sorry if that's harsh, but that's really how I see it.
        jmcqk6 6y ago
        You have an opinion, not a fact. If you think "participation" is only about voting once every 5 years, then you are part of the problem. Although since you say five years instead of 4, perhaps I shouldn't assume you're american. Participation in democracy is about more than voting, especially if you're only voting in a fraction of the elections.

by jmcqk6 6y ago

feralimal 6y ago

Great - can you pay me some money too? I'll call it a tax if it will help..

jmcqk6 6y ago
Obviously you think this is a clever reply, but it isn't. Between this and your parent post, all you're really doing is demonstrating that you have no idea how civilization works. Perhaps you have some idea of how you think things ought to work instead, but that's true of basically everyone. Clearly you perceive no value from taxes and deeply resent that you have to pay them in the first place. And hell, you might even do well for yourself out in the wilderness alone, independent from everyone else. But since you're posting here, that is obviously not your current situation. So if you want to be a part of civilization, you need to pay your dues just like everyone else. And if you don't like it, at least you have the possibility of going something about it yourself, if you can convince enough other people that you're right.
- feralimal 6y ago
  You don't have a choice about being a part of civilisation and whether you pay taxes or not. No choice. But congratulations, you have made yourself feel as if you did and you're happy to go with it. I guess you walk out the door, satisfied at the way your money is spent, the roads, armies, education, etc, etc - just as you would have chosen for yourself!
  - jmcqk6 6y ago
    Just because I'm happy to pay taxes doesn't mean that I'm happy with the ways that money is spent. But I can recognize the inherent need for _some_ entity to serve in this function, and I'm glad that I have one that I can participant in. There is literally no citizen in the world that is completely happy with their country. That is part of being human. Because our views are so diverse, it's impossible to form large groups of people without those types of disagreements. I didn't get a choice about being born, either, but that doesn't mean I'm not going to do what I can with what I have instead of pining for a reality that will never exist.
    - feralimal 6y ago
      You participate once every 5 years in voting for one of 2 meaningful options on a list of ~5-15 issues. No one is happy with that choice. Then, say 50% of the populace vote, 25% get the person who they voted for in. So the 25% (who do not feel fully represented) get to rule over the other 75% who know they are not represented. Basically we all pay taxes into a system that no one feels happy about. And when you think about it, it isn't about what's right - it comes down to who has the force. Its a mafioso monetary extraction system, that indoctrinates its victims. 'Stockholm Syndrome' is the psychological term for when you love your captor; most people who support the government system suffer with this. As a group of people our views are diverse. That's good, right? Large groups of people are hard to manage. So don't manage them. I don't seek to manage other people's affairs. Government is the solution to a problem that doesn't exist - managing lots of people. People should be self-managing. PS There's a difference between jumping to the defence of a system that no one is happy with, and finding a way to survive in a system that is collectivising and dehumanising. In supporting the system as you do, you are literally a turkey voting for Christmas. Sorry if that's harsh, but that's really how I see it.
      - jmcqk6 6y ago
        You have an opinion, not a fact. If you think "participation" is only about voting once every 5 years, then you are part of the problem. Although since you say five years instead of 4, perhaps I shouldn't assume you're american. Participation in democracy is about more than voting, especially if you're only voting in a fraction of the elections.