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Gates is scared people are passing bad information through encrypted platforms such as whatsapp. Next, he will require 24/7 monitoring of every private citizen

Gates is scared people are passing bad information through encrypted platforms such as whatsapp. Next, he will require 24/7 monitoring of every private citizen to make sure we don’t call him mean names.

philliphaydon 6y ago
I'm not convinced e2e encryption exists in WhatsApp. Every time I have conversations about products in whats app I get those products as adverts in Facebook.
- mewpmewp2 6y ago
  I have had this happen without any devices nearby, consistently, meaning we must be chipped already.
- Buge 6y ago
  Did you or your correspondent view a web page related to the product before or after the conversation? Viewing web pages is quite common. Facebook also has a button next to ads saying why you were shown the ad. What does that say? Also the causation might be in the other direction. You and your correspondent might have seen an ad that then caused you to have the conversation.
  - philliphaydon 6y ago
    Nope. So my current apartment is on the 28th floor. It's common to have gates/grills on the windows here in Singapore. But this apartment, AFAIK the family didn't have kids so they never got it done. So I messaged my agent and said "i love the apartment but the windows don't have any gates or safety catches, my understanding is gates are pretty expensive, would it be possible to atleast get safety catches on the windows?" Never googled or anything like that. For the next couple of months I had constant adverts for windows gates in Facebook.
    - Buge 6y ago
      Your landlord might have immediately googled them and viewed some sites about them. And do you and your landlord have the same internet connection? How did you know gates are expensive?
      - cranekam 6y ago
        Sharing an internet connection isn’t enough for ads tracking, otherwise everyone behind the same NAT would get the same ads.
        rsfern 6y ago
        I think this has started happening to me lately! I use pihole with the default block lists as well (in the US), which of course doesn’t get everything, but generally works pretty well. So today my wife and I were looking at dogs that need forever homes using her laptop Later I got a dog food ad on my laptop that specifically mentioned shelter rescue pets. I haven’t used any of my devices or accounts for dog-related searches for at least two months.
        jlokier 6y ago
        IP address is one of many signals used to build a statistical profile. It doesn't match you exactly to the other persons behind the same NAT, but it adds some information, raising the likelihood of ad coincidences a little. I have no idea how much. It's likely to depend on which IP address, and other tracking statistics. If you have diligently blocked lots of tracking state, then IP address will be a relatively stronger signal, and this might (ironically) increase the likelihood of ad coincidences.
    - cranekam 6y ago
      Are you sure you haven’t previously searched for window gates? Searching for things is so second nature by now that half the time we don’t even know we’re doing it. Also, WhatsApp is definitely e2e encrypted. I worked there and saw the implementation (and the difficulties it causes for things like blocking spam/nasties) myself.
- SAI_Peregrinus 6y ago
  That doesn't mean there's no E2E encryption. WhatsApp can take the text of your conversations and also send plaintext to Facebook for ad targeting, while the actual conversation to the other person is still E2E encrypted. Or do "local" analytics on the phone to find keywords for ad targeting. Etc.
  - philliphaydon 6y ago
    So literally defeating the purpose of e2e encryption where the conversations are between me and the other person. Not parsed prior for advertising. In any case people should avoid WhatsApp as it’s clearly less secure now that Facebook owns it.
    - SAI_Peregrinus 6y ago
      Certainly! Just that with a closed-source endpoint the use (or not) of E2EE is meaningless.

philliphaydon 6y ago

I'm not convinced e2e encryption exists in WhatsApp. Every time I have conversations about products in whats app I get those products as adverts in Facebook.

mewpmewp2 6y ago
I have had this happen without any devices nearby, consistently, meaning we must be chipped already.
Buge 6y ago
Did you or your correspondent view a web page related to the product before or after the conversation? Viewing web pages is quite common. Facebook also has a button next to ads saying why you were shown the ad. What does that say? Also the causation might be in the other direction. You and your correspondent might have seen an ad that then caused you to have the conversation.
- philliphaydon 6y ago
  Nope. So my current apartment is on the 28th floor. It's common to have gates/grills on the windows here in Singapore. But this apartment, AFAIK the family didn't have kids so they never got it done. So I messaged my agent and said "i love the apartment but the windows don't have any gates or safety catches, my understanding is gates are pretty expensive, would it be possible to atleast get safety catches on the windows?" Never googled or anything like that. For the next couple of months I had constant adverts for windows gates in Facebook.
  - Buge 6y ago
    Your landlord might have immediately googled them and viewed some sites about them. And do you and your landlord have the same internet connection? How did you know gates are expensive?
    - cranekam 6y ago
      Sharing an internet connection isn’t enough for ads tracking, otherwise everyone behind the same NAT would get the same ads.
      - rsfern 6y ago
        I think this has started happening to me lately! I use pihole with the default block lists as well (in the US), which of course doesn’t get everything, but generally works pretty well. So today my wife and I were looking at dogs that need forever homes using her laptop Later I got a dog food ad on my laptop that specifically mentioned shelter rescue pets. I haven’t used any of my devices or accounts for dog-related searches for at least two months.
      - jlokier 6y ago
        IP address is one of many signals used to build a statistical profile. It doesn't match you exactly to the other persons behind the same NAT, but it adds some information, raising the likelihood of ad coincidences a little. I have no idea how much. It's likely to depend on which IP address, and other tracking statistics. If you have diligently blocked lots of tracking state, then IP address will be a relatively stronger signal, and this might (ironically) increase the likelihood of ad coincidences.
  - cranekam 6y ago
    Are you sure you haven’t previously searched for window gates? Searching for things is so second nature by now that half the time we don’t even know we’re doing it. Also, WhatsApp is definitely e2e encrypted. I worked there and saw the implementation (and the difficulties it causes for things like blocking spam/nasties) myself.
SAI_Peregrinus 6y ago
That doesn't mean there's no E2E encryption. WhatsApp can take the text of your conversations and also send plaintext to Facebook for ad targeting, while the actual conversation to the other person is still E2E encrypted. Or do "local" analytics on the phone to find keywords for ad targeting. Etc.
- philliphaydon 6y ago
  So literally defeating the purpose of e2e encryption where the conversations are between me and the other person. Not parsed prior for advertising. In any case people should avoid WhatsApp as it’s clearly less secure now that Facebook owns it.
  - SAI_Peregrinus 6y ago
    Certainly! Just that with a closed-source endpoint the use (or not) of E2EE is meaningless.