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It feels like to me there’s no good answer to this problem. If we don’t open schools there is two options that I can think of. One that a parent quits their job

It feels like to me there’s no good answer to this problem. If we don’t open schools there is two options that I can think of. One that a parent quits their job and stays home to care for the kids which is probably what most of the HN crowd can do, but more and more families require two incomes. The other option is the kids get sent to a day care or study pod that we don’t have the resources to inspect on the same basis as schools and the spread is worse. A part of me thinks we should open school for the younger ones, halve class size, require masks, introduce daily disinfecting, and have the older kids do distance learning but it seems too many schools have put off prep because they were sure that the virus would be gone. For our daughter we are still up in the air on what to do and school begins in a week or two and they are doing distance learning for the first quarter of the year. Note I am assuming kids can spread it as well as adults there may not conclusive evidence of this but it’s the safest assumption route to go down.

generationP 6y ago
This might not be very popular among the "think of the children" crowd, but what if we plainly stop classifying 12-year old kids staying at home alone as child neglect for the duration of this crisis? Asking kids to run a gauntlet of bureaucratic strictures with all of the stress that school entails but not half the socialization and fun is not going to do them any better in terms of mental health. And parents are spending as much time with their children as never before (see https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/2017/11/27/parents-now-spend-twice-as-much-time-with-their-children-as-50-years-ago#:~:text=Daily%20chart-,Parents%20now%20spend%20twice%20as%20much%20time,children%20as%2050%20years%20ago&text=PARENTS%20these%20days%20spend%20a,but%20104%20minutes%20in%202012 https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/2017/11/27/parents-.... ); it's not like we're in danger of getting wolf children if we turn the crank down a bit.
- R0b0t1 6y ago
  Has that been prosecuted as neglect? I was left alone from and earlier age.
  - auxym 6y ago
    I was babysitting younger cousins at 13. As in, I actually took babysitting classes at that age, it was common and socially accepted.
  - ghaff 6y ago
    There have probably been man bites dog type of stories (that may also not include the whole story), but it's hard to imagine leaving a normal high school student home alone being "neglect" absent other circumstances.
jonahbenton 6y ago
There is no good answer. It is possible to do child care safely, as some programs in NYC remarkably demonstrated over the spring and summer, but it is all too easy to fail. And even "success" still involves some level of infection, spread, and risk of death or long term health impacts in the participants. The overall aggregate risk may be low, but the predictability in any particular case is also low, so engaging is something like playing a game of Russian Roulette. That said, in NYC, we are open to having our 3 kids return to in-person school, at least in the 1st quarter, while we expect 2nd and 3rd quarters over winter to be full lockdown. Even if there is a return for the start of 1st quarter, we do not expect it to last, as the temporary quarantine bar is low, and the overall fragility of the dependencies and relationships required is high.
u801e 6y ago
> A part of me thinks we should open school for the younger ones, halve class size, require masks, introduce daily disinfecting, Younger children are not very likely to maintain distance from one another nor will they keep their masks on. They're also likely to talk loudly or scream which would increase the likelihood of viral transmission. Unfortunately, distance learning is not a realistic option for younger children. > Note I am assuming kids can spread it as well as adults I have not kept up with research about how likely covid-19 is transmitted between people when comparing adults versus children. But looking at historical data in terms of viral transmission between children in school and daycare settings and the fact that children tend to be less fastidious compared to adults, it stands to reason that their will be viral outbreaks regardless of what measures the school takes.

generationP 6y ago

This might not be very popular among the "think of the children" crowd, but what if we plainly stop classifying 12-year old kids staying at home alone as child neglect for the duration of this crisis? Asking kids to run a gauntlet of bureaucratic strictures with all of the stress that school entails but not half the socialization and fun is not going to do them any better in terms of mental health. And parents are spending as much time with their children as never before (see https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/2017/11/27/parents-now-spend-twice-as-much-time-with-their-children-as-50-years-ago#:~:text=Daily%20chart-,Parents%20now%20spend%20twice%20as%20much%20time,children%20as%2050%20years%20ago&text=PARENTS%20these%20days%20spend%20a,but%20104%20minutes%20in%202012 https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/2017/11/27/parents-.... ); it's not like we're in danger of getting wolf children if we turn the crank down a bit.

R0b0t1 6y ago
Has that been prosecuted as neglect? I was left alone from and earlier age.
- auxym 6y ago
  I was babysitting younger cousins at 13. As in, I actually took babysitting classes at that age, it was common and socially accepted.
- ghaff 6y ago
  There have probably been man bites dog type of stories (that may also not include the whole story), but it's hard to imagine leaving a normal high school student home alone being "neglect" absent other circumstances.

jonahbenton 6y ago

There is no good answer. It is possible to do child care safely, as some programs in NYC remarkably demonstrated over the spring and summer, but it is all too easy to fail. And even "success" still involves some level of infection, spread, and risk of death or long term health impacts in the participants. The overall aggregate risk may be low, but the predictability in any particular case is also low, so engaging is something like playing a game of Russian Roulette. That said, in NYC, we are open to having our 3 kids return to in-person school, at least in the 1st quarter, while we expect 2nd and 3rd quarters over winter to be full lockdown. Even if there is a return for the start of 1st quarter, we do not expect it to last, as the temporary quarantine bar is low, and the overall fragility of the dependencies and relationships required is high.

u801e 6y ago

> A part of me thinks we should open school for the younger ones, halve class size, require masks, introduce daily disinfecting, Younger children are not very likely to maintain distance from one another nor will they keep their masks on. They're also likely to talk loudly or scream which would increase the likelihood of viral transmission. Unfortunately, distance learning is not a realistic option for younger children. > Note I am assuming kids can spread it as well as adults I have not kept up with research about how likely covid-19 is transmitted between people when comparing adults versus children. But looking at historical data in terms of viral transmission between children in school and daycare settings and the fact that children tend to be less fastidious compared to adults, it stands to reason that their will be viral outbreaks regardless of what measures the school takes.