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> "There's no situation where you have a really highly religious nation that's highly successful socially." I guess it all depends on how you are defining 'rel
by madspindel 6y ago
> "There's no situation where you have a really highly religious nation that's highly successful socially."
I guess it all depends on how you are defining 'religious'. Without Christianity, the West wouldn't have universities, hospitals and democracies. It also looks like the decline of Christianity in modern society leads to stagnation and mimesis.
- croes 6y agoThe king said to the priest, "You keep them stupid, I'll keep them poor." Religion seldom was the way to democracy.
- madspindel 6y agoThis article seems to disagree: https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/2019/11/23/medieval-catholicism-nudged-europe-towards-democracy-and-development https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/2019/11/23/medieval...
- ReactiveJelly 6y ago> It also looks like the decline of Christianity in modern society leads to stagnation and mimesis. I'm doing fine without it. I would vote for government healthcare and democracy if it was on the ballot.
- willvarfar 6y agoThe parts of the west that were Muslim in the Middle Ages were famed for their learning eg Spain?
- tonyedgecombe 6y agoWithout Christianity, the West wouldn't have universities, hospitals and democracies. You don't really know that because we didn't try it. What is certain is those institutions have been increasing in size and number whilst religiosity has been decreasing in many nations. It also looks like the decline of Christianity in modern society leads to stagnation and mimesis. It certainly hasn't led to economic decline, we have never been so wealthy. We have never lived so long. The chance of dying from violence has never been so low.
- kstenerud 6y ago> Without Christianity, the West wouldn't have universities, hospitals and democracies All of these predate christianity.
- madspindel 6y agoSome forms, maybe. But the first real hospital for strangers (hospitality) was by the Roman Catholic Church. That's why all hospitals in the West have the symbol of Christ. The first real university was founded by the Roman Catholic Church and the first real democracy was a Christian nation.
- kstenerud 6y agoThe first known hospital was founded in 291 B.C. in Greece. The first real democracy was also Greece.
- madspindel 6y agoHealing temple != Hospital. Women and blacks might disagree with your second argument.
- kstenerud 6y agoTemple = bad, church = good. Got it. You may want to take a look at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hospital#History https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hospital#History The first "christian" democracies only gave the vote to men of the aristocracy (even less representation than in ancient Greece). Universal suffrage is not a christian victory.
- renewiltord 6y agoThe evidence looks pretty good, actually, to support this thesis (though it is overly narrow in using 'Christianity' instead of 'Organized Religion'). Non-free societies were very good at crunching through people to produce overall societal progress especially if they applied the Greater Good deceit and the Afterlife deceit. Perhaps the real tragedy is that we are now all free, and I, a non-slave, choose not to enrich society at large but myself. But that's not a tragedy I have that much sympathy for. I'd rather be a non-slave on this Earth than have a galactic humanity where I'm a serf.