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Can you say more about what you mean when you said they're "share-everything?" I'm not entirely sure what you mean by that, since, for example, we do diesel in

by jamwt 16y ago

Can you say more about what you mean when you said they're "share-everything?" I'm not entirely sure what you mean by that, since, for example, we do diesel in what we consider to be a "shared nothing" approach at Bump. Redis is the transport (queuing, pubsub) and the network-bound state, while diesel loops are stateless. In fact, the higher-level erlang-style stuff that's not released yet really abstracts the idea of queues and consumers to the point where it's not entirely clear or important if particular jobs are within the same process of even the same machine (in practice, they usually aren't).

ianb 16y ago
Generally cooperative multitasking systems like these (anything based on greenlets, I think) mean that you are running concurrent tasks in a single process, with a single set of shared data. It's basically the same as threads, only you can't have multiple tasks literally accessing the same data at the same time (though with the GIL I guess technically that's true with threads too ;).
- euccastro 16y ago
  Just don't access the same data? Threads, greenlets, tasklets, etc. allow you to share state, but don't force you to. Greenlets/tasklets are game changing with respect to OS threads not because they introduce new ways of working, but because their performance and scalability afford you ways of working that would be theoretically possible but impractical with threads. The GIL only widens that gap.
- jamwt 16y ago
  Well, it's only shared if you share it! I guess it boils down to "don't use mutable globals". That's as true in threaded environments as it is in async ones. If your requirement is that there must be system-enforced safety rather than safe practices and idioms, I'd say Python isn't the right tool (Haskell is) to begin with. As you know, Python is all about practices, idioms, and discipline.

by jamwt 16y ago

ianb 16y ago

Generally cooperative multitasking systems like these (anything based on greenlets, I think) mean that you are running concurrent tasks in a single process, with a single set of shared data. It's basically the same as threads, only you can't have multiple tasks literally accessing the same data at the same time (though with the GIL I guess technically that's true with threads too ;).

euccastro 16y ago
Just don't access the same data? Threads, greenlets, tasklets, etc. allow you to share state, but don't force you to. Greenlets/tasklets are game changing with respect to OS threads not because they introduce new ways of working, but because their performance and scalability afford you ways of working that would be theoretically possible but impractical with threads. The GIL only widens that gap.
jamwt 16y ago
Well, it's only shared if you share it! I guess it boils down to "don't use mutable globals". That's as true in threaded environments as it is in async ones. If your requirement is that there must be system-enforced safety rather than safe practices and idioms, I'd say Python isn't the right tool (Haskell is) to begin with. As you know, Python is all about practices, idioms, and discipline.