4 ms·

I know "stimulus" is in the CNN title, but I really hate that term. If the money is going towards rent and necessities, its not stimulus, its a life-line.

WrtCdEvrydy 6y ago
One party believes anything you get from the government for free should be a 'stimulus' and not ongoing.
- r2b2 6y ago
  What can a government provide for free that neither causes inflation, nor requires tax dollars? -- • The above stands whether temporary or ongoing. • Land distribution is kind of free as long as it's unclaimed and there's plenty.
- ykevinator 6y ago
  Members of the party that dismisses social services as "handouts" should not get free rent
roenxi 6y ago
What gets me is surely, surely there is some better solution here than handing out money to everyone who has a problem. How many assumptions can be clumped into one headline. Can't let rents drop under market forces, can't let banks go bankrupt, landlords can't take a hit. Only the taxpayer can bear these burdens. This is the part that should really upset the free marketeers. The market wants to change and CNN wants government to step in and promote stasis. Some might call it stability. I don't think people should be out on the street, but someone responsible has to feel the pain for the mistakes here otherwise the root cause, whatever it is, will not be fixed.
- josho 6y ago
  > feel the pain for the mistakes here otherwise the root cause, whatever it is, will not be fixed. In my opinion the mistakes are the decades long eroding of public services paired with the tolerance for growing inequality in society. Unfortunately neither party seems genuinely interested in addressing these root causes.
- justin66 6y ago
  Dogmatism.
- nickthemagicman 6y ago
  The solution was not to go into quarantine in the first place like Sweden who has basically beaten Coronavirus at this point. Now we pay the price for poor decisions.
- CarelessExpert 6y ago
  > Can't let rents drop under market forces, can't let banks go bankrupt, landlords can't take a hit. Sure, that'd be fine (well, it probably wouldn't be, but I'll go with it for the sake of argument) if we had months or years for the market to react. But it doesn't work that fast. By the time rents correct you'll have millions of homeless. But I guess that's better because... reasons? > I don't think people should be out on the street, but someone responsible has to feel the pain for the mistakes here otherwise the root cause, whatever it is, will not be fixed. Huh? The root cause is a once in a hundred year pandemic. What other solution would you propose, other than a time machine?
  - roenxi 6y ago
    > if we had months or years for the market to react. Markets are generally the fastest thing to react to any change in circumstances. Rents in my area are already 60% of what they were pre-coronavirus. The Aspen Institute report is, on the face of it, silly. 40% of renters are not going to be evicted. That would imply 40% of rental properties sitting vacant and there is no way landlords would accept that outcome. Landlords don't want (and probably can't afford) to have large amounts of housing stock sitting empty. > By the time rents correct you'll have millions of homeless. But I guess that's better because... reasons? The world has changed. People need to reorganise their lifestyles to cope with that change. It certainly isn't the governments job to try and maintain a delusional clinging to lifestyles that don't work any more. > What other solution would you propose, other than a time machine? Fixing a root cause doesn't help the current crisis. If I have a step on a nail then fixing the root cause (putting the nail away) doesn't change the fact my foot hurts. It helps for the next one; there is no reason to think this is a 1:100 year pandemic. It is probably a 1:20 or 1:30 year pandemic conditional on modern air travel [0]. People will need to get used to this sort of thing. If you want long term solutions; loose construction requirements that promote abundant housing, monetary/fiscal policy that promotes low debt loads and high home ownership. If you want short term solutions; government guarantee of a place in mass housing (not particularly pleasant conditions, but indoors, safe & sanitary) + 3 meals a day. People shouldn't be starving on the street but people need to fund their own lifestyles - not taxpayers. If you want radical solutions; end the lockdowns and let people work. [0] https://ourworldindata.org/tourism https://ourworldindata.org/tourism
tootahe45 6y ago
Except the prices for rent and necessities would drop without the 'stimulus', so it's not like people would just die without it. All the stimulus achieves is stock market maintenance for the socialist in chief to be re-elected.
- jetpackjoe 6y ago
  But then you enter into a dangerous deflationary cycle.
- sixothree 6y ago
  > so it's not like people would just die without it People will go without medicine.
- Barrin92 6y ago
  it's somewhat reasonable argument for rent in regions where landlords have siphoned off huge economic rents, but for everyone else in the economy falling prices means economic damage as well, people are being paid with the money you pay for groceries and coffee.

WrtCdEvrydy 6y ago

One party believes anything you get from the government for free should be a 'stimulus' and not ongoing.

r2b2 6y ago
What can a government provide for free that neither causes inflation, nor requires tax dollars? -- • The above stands whether temporary or ongoing. • Land distribution is kind of free as long as it's unclaimed and there's plenty.
ykevinator 6y ago
Members of the party that dismisses social services as "handouts" should not get free rent

roenxi 6y ago

What gets me is surely, surely there is some better solution here than handing out money to everyone who has a problem. How many assumptions can be clumped into one headline. Can't let rents drop under market forces, can't let banks go bankrupt, landlords can't take a hit. Only the taxpayer can bear these burdens. This is the part that should really upset the free marketeers. The market wants to change and CNN wants government to step in and promote stasis. Some might call it stability. I don't think people should be out on the street, but someone responsible has to feel the pain for the mistakes here otherwise the root cause, whatever it is, will not be fixed.

josho 6y ago
> feel the pain for the mistakes here otherwise the root cause, whatever it is, will not be fixed. In my opinion the mistakes are the decades long eroding of public services paired with the tolerance for growing inequality in society. Unfortunately neither party seems genuinely interested in addressing these root causes.
justin66 6y ago
Dogmatism.
nickthemagicman 6y ago
The solution was not to go into quarantine in the first place like Sweden who has basically beaten Coronavirus at this point. Now we pay the price for poor decisions.
CarelessExpert 6y ago
> Can't let rents drop under market forces, can't let banks go bankrupt, landlords can't take a hit. Sure, that'd be fine (well, it probably wouldn't be, but I'll go with it for the sake of argument) if we had months or years for the market to react. But it doesn't work that fast. By the time rents correct you'll have millions of homeless. But I guess that's better because... reasons? > I don't think people should be out on the street, but someone responsible has to feel the pain for the mistakes here otherwise the root cause, whatever it is, will not be fixed. Huh? The root cause is a once in a hundred year pandemic. What other solution would you propose, other than a time machine?
- roenxi 6y ago
  > if we had months or years for the market to react. Markets are generally the fastest thing to react to any change in circumstances. Rents in my area are already 60% of what they were pre-coronavirus. The Aspen Institute report is, on the face of it, silly. 40% of renters are not going to be evicted. That would imply 40% of rental properties sitting vacant and there is no way landlords would accept that outcome. Landlords don't want (and probably can't afford) to have large amounts of housing stock sitting empty. > By the time rents correct you'll have millions of homeless. But I guess that's better because... reasons? The world has changed. People need to reorganise their lifestyles to cope with that change. It certainly isn't the governments job to try and maintain a delusional clinging to lifestyles that don't work any more. > What other solution would you propose, other than a time machine? Fixing a root cause doesn't help the current crisis. If I have a step on a nail then fixing the root cause (putting the nail away) doesn't change the fact my foot hurts. It helps for the next one; there is no reason to think this is a 1:100 year pandemic. It is probably a 1:20 or 1:30 year pandemic conditional on modern air travel [0]. People will need to get used to this sort of thing. If you want long term solutions; loose construction requirements that promote abundant housing, monetary/fiscal policy that promotes low debt loads and high home ownership. If you want short term solutions; government guarantee of a place in mass housing (not particularly pleasant conditions, but indoors, safe & sanitary) + 3 meals a day. People shouldn't be starving on the street but people need to fund their own lifestyles - not taxpayers. If you want radical solutions; end the lockdowns and let people work. [0] https://ourworldindata.org/tourism https://ourworldindata.org/tourism

tootahe45 6y ago

Except the prices for rent and necessities would drop without the 'stimulus', so it's not like people would just die without it. All the stimulus achieves is stock market maintenance for the socialist in chief to be re-elected.

jetpackjoe 6y ago
But then you enter into a dangerous deflationary cycle.
sixothree 6y ago
> so it's not like people would just die without it People will go without medicine.
Barrin92 6y ago
it's somewhat reasonable argument for rent in regions where landlords have siphoned off huge economic rents, but for everyone else in the economy falling prices means economic damage as well, people are being paid with the money you pay for groceries and coffee.