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Yes, by mirroring China’s authoritarianism and restricting the freedom of Americans. I’m living overseas and now my government is telling me I can’t use WeChat?

Yes, by mirroring China’s authoritarianism and restricting the freedom of Americans. I’m living overseas and now my government is telling me I can’t use WeChat? Telling me who I can and cannot trade with, etc. Restrictions on trade with China are attacks on our freedom.

remarkEon 6y ago
It is absolutely within the purview of a Sovereign Nation to decide, within the confines of relevant statutes, what companies are allowed to operate within its borders. Trade restrictions are absolutely normal, and are well inline with established practices. What are economic sanctions, after all, but a restriction on the freedom to conduct commerce?
- bmitc 6y ago
  What is the trade reason why these apps are being banned?
  - Markoff 6y ago
    Removing unfair advantage these apps have by building their base in China and creating snowball effect when trying to communicate from abroad with Chinese users? Later you see your foreign contact has also Wechat to talk with Chinese, so why not to talk also with your nonchinese contact through WeChat. Anyway the bigger issue here really is tax evasion through wechat payments or security threats thanks to unlimited access of Chinese gov to your phone storage. EDIT: I see Chinese wumaos have field day in this comments section downvoting everything left and right.
ac29 6y ago
How do you feel about restrictions on trade with North Korea, Syria, or Iran?
- alexmingoia 6y ago
  The same, especially with regards to communications and consumer goods. We’re talking about a chat and payments app... It’s not an actual national security issue like selling China nukes or something.
  - ss3000 6y ago
    Private chats can contain sensitive material that could be used to extort/blackmail government officials and/or business leaders, and in-app payments can be used for tax evasion, money laundering and bypassing sanctions. That in combination with the fact that TenCent or any large Chinese corporation is essentially an extension of the government means that WeChat can very plausibly become a threat to national security if it gains widespread adoption. While I agree with your stance that this is infringing on personal freedoms of American citizens, and I too wish our leaders wouldn't always so eagerly infringe on personal freedoms in the name of national security, the national security claim itself does have merit.
    - alexmingoia 6y ago
      The military and government officials can avoid use of the apps, without banning them for Americans. As they have before WeChat, and before the Internet. I think the notion that WeChat is a threat to national security is honestly ridiculous. National security is a legal excuse to do things Trump otherwise wouldn’t be able to do in his pursuit of a trade war.
      - ss3000 6y ago
        There's no way to predict in advance who's going to become a government official. When they do, and if they used WeChat before then, the damage is done. Material on those close to the officials can also be used against them in similar manner. Again, not condoning the restriction of personal freedoms, but the national security angle is not totally without merit.
    - chrisco255 6y ago
chauchakching 6y ago
https://citizenlab.ca/2020/05/we-chat-they-watch/ https://citizenlab.ca/2020/05/we-chat-they-watch/
EE84M3i 6y ago
My understanding is almost all countries have laws that apply to their citizens abroad. If you don't like it, you're welcome to renounce your American citizenship (at a price)

remarkEon 6y ago

It is absolutely within the purview of a Sovereign Nation to decide, within the confines of relevant statutes, what companies are allowed to operate within its borders. Trade restrictions are absolutely normal, and are well inline with established practices. What are economic sanctions, after all, but a restriction on the freedom to conduct commerce?

bmitc 6y ago
What is the trade reason why these apps are being banned?
- Markoff 6y ago
  Removing unfair advantage these apps have by building their base in China and creating snowball effect when trying to communicate from abroad with Chinese users? Later you see your foreign contact has also Wechat to talk with Chinese, so why not to talk also with your nonchinese contact through WeChat. Anyway the bigger issue here really is tax evasion through wechat payments or security threats thanks to unlimited access of Chinese gov to your phone storage. EDIT: I see Chinese wumaos have field day in this comments section downvoting everything left and right.

ac29 6y ago

How do you feel about restrictions on trade with North Korea, Syria, or Iran?

alexmingoia 6y ago
The same, especially with regards to communications and consumer goods. We’re talking about a chat and payments app... It’s not an actual national security issue like selling China nukes or something.
- ss3000 6y ago
  Private chats can contain sensitive material that could be used to extort/blackmail government officials and/or business leaders, and in-app payments can be used for tax evasion, money laundering and bypassing sanctions. That in combination with the fact that TenCent or any large Chinese corporation is essentially an extension of the government means that WeChat can very plausibly become a threat to national security if it gains widespread adoption. While I agree with your stance that this is infringing on personal freedoms of American citizens, and I too wish our leaders wouldn't always so eagerly infringe on personal freedoms in the name of national security, the national security claim itself does have merit.
  - alexmingoia 6y ago
    The military and government officials can avoid use of the apps, without banning them for Americans. As they have before WeChat, and before the Internet. I think the notion that WeChat is a threat to national security is honestly ridiculous. National security is a legal excuse to do things Trump otherwise wouldn’t be able to do in his pursuit of a trade war.
    - ss3000 6y ago
      There's no way to predict in advance who's going to become a government official. When they do, and if they used WeChat before then, the damage is done. Material on those close to the officials can also be used against them in similar manner. Again, not condoning the restriction of personal freedoms, but the national security angle is not totally without merit.
  - chrisco255 6y ago

chauchakching 6y ago

https://citizenlab.ca/2020/05/we-chat-they-watch/ https://citizenlab.ca/2020/05/we-chat-they-watch/

EE84M3i 6y ago

My understanding is almost all countries have laws that apply to their citizens abroad. If you don't like it, you're welcome to renounce your American citizenship (at a price)