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When you're living paycheck to paycheck your IQ and decision-making ability is effectively handicapped from having to constantly worry about eating and security

by kanobo 6y ago

When you're living paycheck to paycheck your IQ and decision-making ability is effectively handicapped from having to constantly worry about eating and security. Combine that with a system that can be brutal if you don't have the means, this stat is not at all surprising.

BLKNSLVR 6y ago
> Combine that with a system that can be brutal if you don't have the means And there's the crux of it. "The system", when it's working towards a sustainable civilisation, must provide some level of protection for those who don't have the ability to make good decisions. Scammers and advertising as one example. Regulation and fines that are enforced and sufficiently discouraging. It's too easy to profit off the bottom end. Finding where protections intersect with personal freedoms / responsibility is the perpetual impossibility.
- sv1123 6y ago
  Correction: who don't have the privilege to make good decisions, not ability :)
aliante 6y ago
Most poor Americans are quite fat. They are nowhere near in danger of starvation. They are just undisciplined.
- agdtdudhegsjhs 6y ago
  Why wouldn’t you eat all you can when you’re not sure you’ll continue to eat?
  - aliante 6y ago
    Because the fear is clearly not based on reality given the extra 60 pounds most have. Nowhere are Americans starving in any meaningful numbers. Sure they might not always know a week in advance what they are going to eat, but they could cut their food spending by 1/3 and it would average out.
    - kanobo 6y ago
      You have a very basic understanding of nutrition, a sad view of the world, and a habit of giving very specific numbers based on nothing.
      - aliante 6y ago
        I know that most poor Americans are fat and that means they are eating too much.
        RubberSoul 6y ago
        I decided to look this up and it seems you’re wrong about this [0]. What is your source? [0]: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/products/databriefs/db50.htm https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/products/databriefs/db50.htm
        Anon1096 6y ago
        https://www.niddk.nih.gov/health-information/health-statistics/overweight-obesity https://www.niddk.nih.gov/health-information/health-statisti... Most Americans (2 in 3) are overweight or obese. I only found this on the first link of Google so it's not stratified by wealth, but do you really disbelieve that most poor Americans are overweight?
        mercer 6y ago
        I thought it was common knowledge that poor and/or uneducated people, at least in the West, tend to be more obese, and overall tend to live a less healthy lifestyle. But I'm happy to be wrong. What has usually been the topic of discussion between people with differing political views is 1) whether this can be reduced to a personal choice (ability), and consequently 2) where the responsibilities lie to improve the situation. At least observationally, having lived in both richer and poorer areas of cities around the world, in the poor areas people smoked more, drank more (whether sugary drinks or alcohol), were more obese, had worse teeth, and I saw fewer joggers or other people working out. Because of my political views I tend to feel that many of these poorer/uneducated people both lack the ability and the environment to do 'better', and regardless of whether that is true, I believe societal/collective initiatives would be helpful in changing the situation (whether state- or community-led). I think there are plenty of initiatives to support improvements (church, grassroots movements, non-profits, state-initiatives; pick your poison). The one thing I have trouble with is the, IMO, often self-serving and incredibly myopic view that all these people are just inferior and entirely willingly choosing to live often unhealthy and unhappy lives. When I see a severely obese person, I see someone with problems, not someone who's just a happy, lazy glutton. I've never personally met a fat person who was unapologetically happy with their situation. Far from it.
- kanobo 6y ago
  Nobody said anything about starvation or wants to comment on stereotypes, eating healthy has many things to do with being poor though.
- kunai 6y ago
  You are correct, it's not the food deserts, redlining, institutional and systemic factors, widespread government corruption spearheaded by Coke and McDonalds lobbyists promoting unhealthy products, that led to poor nutritional attainment among poor Americans. It's the lack of discipline. Give me a a break.
  - aliante 6y ago
    > it's not the food deserts As they don’t buy those things. > redlining Not sure what that has to do with food. > institutional and systemic factors Hand waving. > promoting unhealthy products Coke and McDonalds don’t put the straw or the fries in your mouth. The 4th point of yours is the lack of discipline on the part of these people.
- tracer4201 6y ago
  Fat doesn’t mean they’re healthy. People who are obese can only stop eating if they’re still getting vitamins and minerals through some other mechanism. If you just stop eating completely, you could actually kill yourself.
- robjan 6y ago
  When you work 12 hours shifts sometimes it's hard to cook a healthy meal. The next cheapest option is McDonald's and other fast food.

by kanobo 6y ago

BLKNSLVR 6y ago

> Combine that with a system that can be brutal if you don't have the means And there's the crux of it. "The system", when it's working towards a sustainable civilisation, must provide some level of protection for those who don't have the ability to make good decisions. Scammers and advertising as one example. Regulation and fines that are enforced and sufficiently discouraging. It's too easy to profit off the bottom end. Finding where protections intersect with personal freedoms / responsibility is the perpetual impossibility.

sv1123 6y ago
Correction: who don't have the privilege to make good decisions, not ability :)

aliante 6y ago

Most poor Americans are quite fat. They are nowhere near in danger of starvation. They are just undisciplined.

agdtdudhegsjhs 6y ago
Why wouldn’t you eat all you can when you’re not sure you’ll continue to eat?
- aliante 6y ago
  Because the fear is clearly not based on reality given the extra 60 pounds most have. Nowhere are Americans starving in any meaningful numbers. Sure they might not always know a week in advance what they are going to eat, but they could cut their food spending by 1/3 and it would average out.
  - kanobo 6y ago
    You have a very basic understanding of nutrition, a sad view of the world, and a habit of giving very specific numbers based on nothing.
    - aliante 6y ago
      I know that most poor Americans are fat and that means they are eating too much.
      - RubberSoul 6y ago
        I decided to look this up and it seems you’re wrong about this [0]. What is your source? [0]: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/products/databriefs/db50.htm https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/products/databriefs/db50.htm
        Anon1096 6y ago
        https://www.niddk.nih.gov/health-information/health-statistics/overweight-obesity https://www.niddk.nih.gov/health-information/health-statisti... Most Americans (2 in 3) are overweight or obese. I only found this on the first link of Google so it's not stratified by wealth, but do you really disbelieve that most poor Americans are overweight?
        mercer 6y ago
        I thought it was common knowledge that poor and/or uneducated people, at least in the West, tend to be more obese, and overall tend to live a less healthy lifestyle. But I'm happy to be wrong. What has usually been the topic of discussion between people with differing political views is 1) whether this can be reduced to a personal choice (ability), and consequently 2) where the responsibilities lie to improve the situation. At least observationally, having lived in both richer and poorer areas of cities around the world, in the poor areas people smoked more, drank more (whether sugary drinks or alcohol), were more obese, had worse teeth, and I saw fewer joggers or other people working out. Because of my political views I tend to feel that many of these poorer/uneducated people both lack the ability and the environment to do 'better', and regardless of whether that is true, I believe societal/collective initiatives would be helpful in changing the situation (whether state- or community-led). I think there are plenty of initiatives to support improvements (church, grassroots movements, non-profits, state-initiatives; pick your poison). The one thing I have trouble with is the, IMO, often self-serving and incredibly myopic view that all these people are just inferior and entirely willingly choosing to live often unhealthy and unhappy lives. When I see a severely obese person, I see someone with problems, not someone who's just a happy, lazy glutton. I've never personally met a fat person who was unapologetically happy with their situation. Far from it.
kanobo 6y ago
Nobody said anything about starvation or wants to comment on stereotypes, eating healthy has many things to do with being poor though.
kunai 6y ago
You are correct, it's not the food deserts, redlining, institutional and systemic factors, widespread government corruption spearheaded by Coke and McDonalds lobbyists promoting unhealthy products, that led to poor nutritional attainment among poor Americans. It's the lack of discipline. Give me a a break.
- aliante 6y ago
  > it's not the food deserts As they don’t buy those things. > redlining Not sure what that has to do with food. > institutional and systemic factors Hand waving. > promoting unhealthy products Coke and McDonalds don’t put the straw or the fries in your mouth. The 4th point of yours is the lack of discipline on the part of these people.
tracer4201 6y ago
Fat doesn’t mean they’re healthy. People who are obese can only stop eating if they’re still getting vitamins and minerals through some other mechanism. If you just stop eating completely, you could actually kill yourself.
robjan 6y ago
When you work 12 hours shifts sometimes it's hard to cook a healthy meal. The next cheapest option is McDonald's and other fast food.