4 ms·

I think at times the anti-NY Times crowd is as eye-roll worthy as the articles they complain about, but I have to say after reading this article, I can't help b

I think at times the anti-NY Times crowd is as eye-roll worthy as the articles they complain about, but I have to say after reading this article, I can't help but agree with you, it is very narrative driven "journalism."

noelwelsh 6y ago
It's not intended to be a record of fact. It's in the "Critics Notebook", which means it is an opinion piece (as is all criticism; do you expect a review of, say, a movie to be an entirely factual document with no opinion?)
- ntsplnkv2 6y ago
  This isn't a criticism of a particular movie or book. > For decades, the notion of the lone genius in the kitchen has fostered culinary creativity — and restaurants marred by abuse and unfairness. This may be the time for change. This is the first paragraph - it is clearly making claims and an argument for something. Most people reading this would view this as an argument with evidence as such which it presents - it is not a criticism of a book.
ethbro 6y ago
It isn't journalism: it's opinion. It's in the Food section [0], and tagged with "Critic's Notebook" anywhere the article is linked. That apparently being one of their blog / opinion lines for food. It doesn't seem fair to look at modern news conglomerates (which typically combine news and opinion) and complain that the non-news content bismirches the journalism. That content typically funds the journalism, and is the only reason the latter still exists. A fair shot would be saying "I do not feel like this article is appropriately declared as opinion." Which, maybe. But I think that's debatable, and the NYT certainly differentiates a helluva lot better than Fox News and MSNBC. [0] https://www.nytimes.com/section/food https://www.nytimes.com/section/food
- frockington1 6y ago
  I would still expect proper evidence. This is equivalent of an article saying "The End of Goldendoodles" with the evidence being that my neighbors dog died. We should expect more from an institution that claims to be more
- ntsplnkv2 6y ago
  >It doesn't seem fair to look at modern news conglomerates (which typically combine news and opinion) and complain that the non-news content bismirches the journalism. And it's just this attitude that has caused the era of fake news. > A fair shot would be saying "I do not feel like this article is appropriately declared as opinion." Which, maybe. But I think that's debatable, and the NYT certainly differentiates a helluva lot better than Fox News and MSNBC. This is exactly the point. Fox News and MSNBC are some of the worst offenders - this does not excuse the NYT from it. Also I remind people that journalism is not just reporting of facts. If it was all newspapers would be lists of factoids. "Journalism, the collection, preparation, and distribution of news and related commentary" This is very clearly journalism.

noelwelsh 6y ago

It's not intended to be a record of fact. It's in the "Critics Notebook", which means it is an opinion piece (as is all criticism; do you expect a review of, say, a movie to be an entirely factual document with no opinion?)

ntsplnkv2 6y ago
This isn't a criticism of a particular movie or book. > For decades, the notion of the lone genius in the kitchen has fostered culinary creativity — and restaurants marred by abuse and unfairness. This may be the time for change. This is the first paragraph - it is clearly making claims and an argument for something. Most people reading this would view this as an argument with evidence as such which it presents - it is not a criticism of a book.

ethbro 6y ago

It isn't journalism: it's opinion. It's in the Food section [0], and tagged with "Critic's Notebook" anywhere the article is linked. That apparently being one of their blog / opinion lines for food. It doesn't seem fair to look at modern news conglomerates (which typically combine news and opinion) and complain that the non-news content bismirches the journalism. That content typically funds the journalism, and is the only reason the latter still exists. A fair shot would be saying "I do not feel like this article is appropriately declared as opinion." Which, maybe. But I think that's debatable, and the NYT certainly differentiates a helluva lot better than Fox News and MSNBC. [0] https://www.nytimes.com/section/food https://www.nytimes.com/section/food

frockington1 6y ago
I would still expect proper evidence. This is equivalent of an article saying "The End of Goldendoodles" with the evidence being that my neighbors dog died. We should expect more from an institution that claims to be more
ntsplnkv2 6y ago
>It doesn't seem fair to look at modern news conglomerates (which typically combine news and opinion) and complain that the non-news content bismirches the journalism. And it's just this attitude that has caused the era of fake news. > A fair shot would be saying "I do not feel like this article is appropriately declared as opinion." Which, maybe. But I think that's debatable, and the NYT certainly differentiates a helluva lot better than Fox News and MSNBC. This is exactly the point. Fox News and MSNBC are some of the worst offenders - this does not excuse the NYT from it. Also I remind people that journalism is not just reporting of facts. If it was all newspapers would be lists of factoids. "Journalism, the collection, preparation, and distribution of news and related commentary" This is very clearly journalism.