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Maybe I don't understand Brave well enough, but wouldn't I just help create another all powerful gatekeeper? I don't believe cryptocurrencies will work. As soo

Maybe I don't understand Brave well enough, but wouldn't I just help create another all powerful gatekeeper? I don't believe cryptocurrencies will work. As soon as they become widespread they will be banned or regulated just like other forms of electronic payment, including know your customer rules. For the moment, I don't see that we really have the tools to replace ads, much as I would like that.

rglullis 6y ago
> wouldn't I just help create another all powerful gatekeeper? No. The biggest claim of Brave is that all of the information for ad matching is in the browser. So they can not control it. The only thing that Brave can control at the moment is the on-boarding ramps - i.e, if you want to take your BAT out of their wallet and to your own, you need to go through KYC via Uphold.com. But you can pay and contribute BAT to other people even if you haven't done KYC. Even in this case, the KYC that needs to be done is only with Uphold. After you take out your tokens you are free to spend them however you want and no one will ask you anything. > I don't believe cryptocurrencies will work They already do. > regulated just like other forms of electronic payment, including know your customer rules. Even in this libertarian nightmare that you are imagining, crypto would more likely help you to keep your data away from businesses and third-parties. If every transaction needs to be authorized and monitored by the government or central authority, then there is no need for the business to collect any information from you - all they would need is to ensure that you are sending your payment from a government-validated address. Governments don't do that today due to the sheer costs of trying to run such an operation. But tracking things on the blockchain is reasonably easy, so there would be no need for banks and third-parties to do the dirty work for them.
- fauigerzigerk 6y ago
  Could Brave not impose content restrictions on publishers just like app stores?
  - rglullis 6y ago
    On the publishers? I honestly don't see how they would. As far as I know, they are blind on all transactions and none of their channels that publishers can use to register to receive BAT have any kind of declared ToS. In any case, it seems like you are just looking for a way to rationalize your current behavior. I only mentioned Brave because it is the first strong offering for an alternative to the ad-based economy. If for whatever reason Brave stops being a valid alternative, there is nothing holding you to it. Why not try it for yourself?
    - fauigerzigerk 6y ago
      > In any case, it seems like you are just looking for a way to rationalize your current behavior. Not in the least. I find ads annoying and I don‘t have any skin in the game when it comes to advertising. But it‘s not a matter of simply trying Brave. I want to understand how it works for users and also for publishers. And I want to understand how it is not a proprietary system with a gatekeeper role as a structural feature.
      - rglullis 6y ago
        Their advertisement network is only one and the browser gives them some leverage, but there is nothing stopping someone else to create a similar alternative. Brave already has been forked (Dissenter Browser) that remove the BAT side of things. Outside of the potential mooning of the token which would make them rich, I don't really see anything they have that gives them such a dangerous moat. Hell, a competitor could even decide to have an advertisement network that also operates with the BAT supply that has been taken out of the exchanges. If for some reason the company starts doing anything user-hostile, they will lose the business to someone else. The only important thing is that anything is better than the status quo. If you are weary of Brave, you can go for something like flattr, or you can start looking into crypto as a way to pay directly for those you want to support (and still keep your privacy). Whatever you decide, just please realize that "I don't like ads, but I don't see any good alternative" is not a valid statement anymore.

rglullis 6y ago

> wouldn't I just help create another all powerful gatekeeper? No. The biggest claim of Brave is that all of the information for ad matching is in the browser. So they can not control it. The only thing that Brave can control at the moment is the on-boarding ramps - i.e, if you want to take your BAT out of their wallet and to your own, you need to go through KYC via Uphold.com. But you can pay and contribute BAT to other people even if you haven't done KYC. Even in this case, the KYC that needs to be done is only with Uphold. After you take out your tokens you are free to spend them however you want and no one will ask you anything. > I don't believe cryptocurrencies will work They already do. > regulated just like other forms of electronic payment, including know your customer rules. Even in this libertarian nightmare that you are imagining, crypto would more likely help you to keep your data away from businesses and third-parties. If every transaction needs to be authorized and monitored by the government or central authority, then there is no need for the business to collect any information from you - all they would need is to ensure that you are sending your payment from a government-validated address. Governments don't do that today due to the sheer costs of trying to run such an operation. But tracking things on the blockchain is reasonably easy, so there would be no need for banks and third-parties to do the dirty work for them.

fauigerzigerk 6y ago
Could Brave not impose content restrictions on publishers just like app stores?
- rglullis 6y ago
  On the publishers? I honestly don't see how they would. As far as I know, they are blind on all transactions and none of their channels that publishers can use to register to receive BAT have any kind of declared ToS. In any case, it seems like you are just looking for a way to rationalize your current behavior. I only mentioned Brave because it is the first strong offering for an alternative to the ad-based economy. If for whatever reason Brave stops being a valid alternative, there is nothing holding you to it. Why not try it for yourself?
  - fauigerzigerk 6y ago
    > In any case, it seems like you are just looking for a way to rationalize your current behavior. Not in the least. I find ads annoying and I don‘t have any skin in the game when it comes to advertising. But it‘s not a matter of simply trying Brave. I want to understand how it works for users and also for publishers. And I want to understand how it is not a proprietary system with a gatekeeper role as a structural feature.
    - rglullis 6y ago
      Their advertisement network is only one and the browser gives them some leverage, but there is nothing stopping someone else to create a similar alternative. Brave already has been forked (Dissenter Browser) that remove the BAT side of things. Outside of the potential mooning of the token which would make them rich, I don't really see anything they have that gives them such a dangerous moat. Hell, a competitor could even decide to have an advertisement network that also operates with the BAT supply that has been taken out of the exchanges. If for some reason the company starts doing anything user-hostile, they will lose the business to someone else. The only important thing is that anything is better than the status quo. If you are weary of Brave, you can go for something like flattr, or you can start looking into crypto as a way to pay directly for those you want to support (and still keep your privacy). Whatever you decide, just please realize that "I don't like ads, but I don't see any good alternative" is not a valid statement anymore.