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This is serious abuse of privacy. I presume there are privacy laws covering this? And therefore the possibility of legal action on a large scale?

KaiserPro 6y ago
depends on the small print really. I suspect that it would be vague enough to allow "any data you provide to allow us to tailor your experience to you"
- DoofusOfDeath 6y ago
  Is there a way we (regular humans) can turn small-print-abuse against these companies? For example, could some of us: 1. Create a website or piece of software that we expect will be used by some employee of Facebook, Twitter, Microsoft, etc., from their employer's computers. 2. Include Terms of Service and/or clickwrap terms that tilted in our favor. E.g., enter a binding covenant to never perform telemetry of any kind, with clearly defined penalties. And the user also releases us from any obligations we have to them via previous agreements, such as the right to forced arbitration, or their pick of legal jurisdiction for lawsuits, or us covering their legal costs. 3. Once there's sufficient evidence that someone at one of these companies has accepted these terms, and violated them, drag them through the courts. Crowdsource our legal fees to prevent them from avoiding discovery, or settling out of court, or converting to class action and buying off the class's attorneys with an ineffective remedy. I see several acceptable outcomes of this: (a) A competent court establishes legal precedent that shrink-wrap licenses, and/or onerous EULAs / ToSs are unenforceable. And/or (b) We get some measure of justice by causing major financial damage to the companies and individuals who abused our trust in the first place, and perhaps some court-ordered consent degrees that will hobble those companies for decades. Or, worst case: (c) Those companies' lawyers wise up to the risk of their employees accepting such license terms. As a result, those companies become very risk-averse to letting their employees install software or visit unvetted websites. Which makes those companies less productive, and less capable of retaining technical talent that doesn't want to live under such restrictions. Thus planting the seeds of their death by a more agile competitor. EDIT: `s/two/several` because I can't count.
ghastmaster 6y ago
According to the arstechnica article covering this, they have been fined in the past and this current infraction is a violation of their original settlement, which is why they are facing a fine of close to $250m.
rvz 6y ago
> This is serious abuse of privacy. Websites that use 2FA Phone verification: Abuse of privacy? What's that? This is for your 'security' /s Honestly, I avoid services or websites that do this kind of nonsense.
- irishgeoff5 6y ago
  You can always use a disposable phone numberfrom Textita to verify any account online. https://textita.com https://textita.com

KaiserPro 6y ago

depends on the small print really. I suspect that it would be vague enough to allow "any data you provide to allow us to tailor your experience to you"

DoofusOfDeath 6y ago
Is there a way we (regular humans) can turn small-print-abuse against these companies? For example, could some of us: 1. Create a website or piece of software that we expect will be used by some employee of Facebook, Twitter, Microsoft, etc., from their employer's computers. 2. Include Terms of Service and/or clickwrap terms that tilted in our favor. E.g., enter a binding covenant to never perform telemetry of any kind, with clearly defined penalties. And the user also releases us from any obligations we have to them via previous agreements, such as the right to forced arbitration, or their pick of legal jurisdiction for lawsuits, or us covering their legal costs. 3. Once there's sufficient evidence that someone at one of these companies has accepted these terms, and violated them, drag them through the courts. Crowdsource our legal fees to prevent them from avoiding discovery, or settling out of court, or converting to class action and buying off the class's attorneys with an ineffective remedy. I see several acceptable outcomes of this: (a) A competent court establishes legal precedent that shrink-wrap licenses, and/or onerous EULAs / ToSs are unenforceable. And/or (b) We get some measure of justice by causing major financial damage to the companies and individuals who abused our trust in the first place, and perhaps some court-ordered consent degrees that will hobble those companies for decades. Or, worst case: (c) Those companies' lawyers wise up to the risk of their employees accepting such license terms. As a result, those companies become very risk-averse to letting their employees install software or visit unvetted websites. Which makes those companies less productive, and less capable of retaining technical talent that doesn't want to live under such restrictions. Thus planting the seeds of their death by a more agile competitor. EDIT: `s/two/several` because I can't count.

ghastmaster 6y ago

According to the arstechnica article covering this, they have been fined in the past and this current infraction is a violation of their original settlement, which is why they are facing a fine of close to $250m.

rvz 6y ago

> This is serious abuse of privacy. Websites that use 2FA Phone verification: Abuse of privacy? What's that? This is for your 'security' /s Honestly, I avoid services or websites that do this kind of nonsense.

irishgeoff5 6y ago
You can always use a disposable phone numberfrom Textita to verify any account online. https://textita.com https://textita.com