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Yes, they need at least one Apple Silicon machine, which demonstrates that it is competitive for absolute CPU power and of course as a machine for all the devel

by _ph_ 6y ago

Yes, they need at least one Apple Silicon machine, which demonstrates that it is competitive for absolute CPU power and of course as a machine for all the developers. They do need not only a testing machine, but should be doing the development itself on an Apple Silicon machine. That is, why I would consider the rumor about a 13 or 14 inch MB Pro with Apple Silicon for highly plausible. The 16 inch would then follow later, with an even beefier CPU.

ogre_codes 6y ago
I wouldn't be surprised to see the 13/14 and the 16 inch both released this year. That would mean 2 significantly different 16" MBPs in the same year. My thinking here is that it would be quite odd if they released a 14" MacBook Pro which is faster than the more expensive current 16" model.
- _ph_ 6y ago
  The 16" was just refreshed and requires both a very beefy cpu and gpu. Not sure Apple will bring that with the first iteration. The 13" MB Pro has an integrated GPU, so that sounds more like a first step for Apple. Also, I think the Intel version of the 16" will stick around for quite a long time, might even be the last Intel machine sold in parallel to Apple Silicon, as developers and many others might require an Intel-based machine.
  - ogre_codes 6y ago
    How can Apple say their new CPUs are the best/ fastest... but aren't good enough to ship in their flagship laptop? This first launch is going to be the most scrutinized & criticized Mac Apple has launched in years. Apple knows this and they are going to put a beefy CPU in their new machine to silence the critics. If they can't beat Intel performance at launch, what are the chances they are going to be able to beat them a year down the line? And since it would be quite weird to have the smaller MacBook be the better/ faster iOS development machine, it seems like the 16" is pretty likely. Maybe not launch day, but within the first few months at the latest. They might keep the Intel based MacBook around and sell them at the same time, but I doubt it will be the only 16" MacBook they sell for long. It just doesn't make any sense.
    - _ph_ 6y ago
      That is the reason why I think at least one of the MB Pros will be available on Apple Silicon from the start, I am just not sure they will start with the 16", as they would have to replace a dedicated GPU for that machine.
      - rsynnott 6y ago
        > I am just not sure they will start with the 16", as they would have to replace a dedicated GPU for that machine. Why? The 2015 15" came with an integrated GPU option (and that was by far the most popular SKU, AFAIK).
        _ph_ 6y ago
        Because one important feature of the large MB Pro is the availability of a dedicated GPU making it a decent graphics machine when connected to an external screen. I am certainly stressing the GPU of mine :)
        ogre_codes 6y ago
        My thinking is this is exactly the use-case Apple needs to prove they can compete with and arguably the case where they should shine. With ARM's much better thermal characteristics, Apple should be able to get much better graphics performance. It's certainly the tougher nut to crack.
      - Veedrac 6y ago
        You are massively underestimating the performance of Apple's GPUs. They can beat the 5600M. https://www.reddit.com/r/hardware/comments/hgahzx/apple_gpu_performance_projections/ https://www.reddit.com/r/hardware/comments/hgahzx/apple_gpu_...

by _ph_ 6y ago

ogre_codes 6y ago

I wouldn't be surprised to see the 13/14 and the 16 inch both released this year. That would mean 2 significantly different 16" MBPs in the same year. My thinking here is that it would be quite odd if they released a 14" MacBook Pro which is faster than the more expensive current 16" model.

_ph_ 6y ago
The 16" was just refreshed and requires both a very beefy cpu and gpu. Not sure Apple will bring that with the first iteration. The 13" MB Pro has an integrated GPU, so that sounds more like a first step for Apple. Also, I think the Intel version of the 16" will stick around for quite a long time, might even be the last Intel machine sold in parallel to Apple Silicon, as developers and many others might require an Intel-based machine.
- ogre_codes 6y ago
  How can Apple say their new CPUs are the best/ fastest... but aren't good enough to ship in their flagship laptop? This first launch is going to be the most scrutinized & criticized Mac Apple has launched in years. Apple knows this and they are going to put a beefy CPU in their new machine to silence the critics. If they can't beat Intel performance at launch, what are the chances they are going to be able to beat them a year down the line? And since it would be quite weird to have the smaller MacBook be the better/ faster iOS development machine, it seems like the 16" is pretty likely. Maybe not launch day, but within the first few months at the latest. They might keep the Intel based MacBook around and sell them at the same time, but I doubt it will be the only 16" MacBook they sell for long. It just doesn't make any sense.
  - _ph_ 6y ago
    That is the reason why I think at least one of the MB Pros will be available on Apple Silicon from the start, I am just not sure they will start with the 16", as they would have to replace a dedicated GPU for that machine.
    - rsynnott 6y ago
      > I am just not sure they will start with the 16", as they would have to replace a dedicated GPU for that machine. Why? The 2015 15" came with an integrated GPU option (and that was by far the most popular SKU, AFAIK).
      - _ph_ 6y ago
        Because one important feature of the large MB Pro is the availability of a dedicated GPU making it a decent graphics machine when connected to an external screen. I am certainly stressing the GPU of mine :)
        ogre_codes 6y ago
        My thinking is this is exactly the use-case Apple needs to prove they can compete with and arguably the case where they should shine. With ARM's much better thermal characteristics, Apple should be able to get much better graphics performance. It's certainly the tougher nut to crack.
    - Veedrac 6y ago
      You are massively underestimating the performance of Apple's GPUs. They can beat the 5600M. https://www.reddit.com/r/hardware/comments/hgahzx/apple_gpu_performance_projections/ https://www.reddit.com/r/hardware/comments/hgahzx/apple_gpu_...