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>The main way people use VS code is through the proprietarized official build that uses the official EULA The blog author complained about "Live Share" as one

by jasode 6y ago

>The main way people use VS code is through the proprietarized official build that uses the official EULA The blog author complained about "Live Share" as one example. As far as I can tell, "Live Share" is not in the builds one downloads from Microsoft's "Visual Studio Code" website: https://code.visualstudio.com/download https://code.visualstudio.com/download The Live Share feature is downloaded from a separate web page: https://marketplace.visualstudio.com/items?itemName=MS-vsliveshare.vsliveshare-pack https://marketplace.visualstudio.com/items?itemName=MS-vsliv... This separation seems similar to SQLite Encryption Extension. Can someone explain how the situations are not analogous? The github page for "Visual Studio Code" prominently displays "Open Source" in its title: https://github.com/microsoft/vscode https://github.com/microsoft/vscode I'm willing to be convinced that it's a marketing deception and "open source" should be removed but so far, I haven't seen any precedent from other hybrid open/closed source projects justifying that.

winkeltripel 6y ago
> Can someone explain how the situations are not analogous? The difference is that typical usage of SQLite is co-located with an application, such that you don't need encryption, and it doesn't market itself as a great database to stand up on a far-away server. VSCode is marketing these extensions with the core product, as features thereof. They seem to be much closer to critical, core functionality. I think that they are functionally similar situations, except that nobody uses/cares-about that SQLite extension. Microsoft is also marketing as if VS Code is open source. One claim or the other is fine, but the combination is deceptive. There are many closed-source components which are part of VS Code, if indirectly.
- edoceo 6y ago
  Hmm. Nobody I know that uses VSCode uses either Remote or LiveShare. They don't seem critical or core to me.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - codemonkey-zeta 6y ago
    Not that they are critical or core, but that they are, in the words of the original author, "the best parts of VScode." All the core and critical features of VScode exist in every other editor. LiveShare and Remote are, as far as I and the author can tell, not replicated by any other editor, and are therefore (subjectively) the "best parts". Whether or not you know anyone who uses the features is irrelevant.
    - edoceo 6y ago
      The person I was replying to used the words "critical" and "core". As to best (admittedly subjective) if they are so good I'd think that one of the 100s of devs I know depend on them. The only close one was Remote - which other editors do too - When I showed that remote drops code to the far end machine we determined that to be too risky - and went back to sshfs. Also, if those extension are so "best" why hasn't a replica been created? Or why didn't any other editor have them? It might be those extension are not so compelling. Also, my previous favorite editor (jEdit) had remote features back in like 2003 - maybe earlier.
      - codemonkey-zeta 6y ago
        I don't agree with the word choice of the parent, but I think the argument stands if you replace "critical" and "core" with "best". That's why I chose to re-reference the original article. I'm curious if you've used the live share features personally, and if you have if you've found value in them. I suspect many devs do not like collaborative programming in general, and so may never use them or like them if they have. As someone who thoroughly enjoys collaborative programming, I can tell you that these features are extremely compelling. It's way easier to tell your designer friend to boot up VScode and click on a link to your live app running locally than almost any other solution I've found. It also makes pair programming extremely easy. I used to use vim and now emacs for everything. I've also used JetBrains products for years. The only reason I ever boot up VScode is for those features. You just can't replicate the experience in any other editor as easily. Every other feature of VScode I've found a similar or better solution in every other editor. I'd be interested to hear any other feature of VScode that you think is as compelling, without parallel in any other editor. I suspect there are few/none.

by jasode 6y ago

winkeltripel 6y ago

> Can someone explain how the situations are not analogous? The difference is that typical usage of SQLite is co-located with an application, such that you don't need encryption, and it doesn't market itself as a great database to stand up on a far-away server. VSCode is marketing these extensions with the core product, as features thereof. They seem to be much closer to critical, core functionality. I think that they are functionally similar situations, except that nobody uses/cares-about that SQLite extension. Microsoft is also marketing as if VS Code is open source. One claim or the other is fine, but the combination is deceptive. There are many closed-source components which are part of VS Code, if indirectly.

edoceo 6y ago
Hmm. Nobody I know that uses VSCode uses either Remote or LiveShare. They don't seem critical or core to me.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- codemonkey-zeta 6y ago
  Not that they are critical or core, but that they are, in the words of the original author, "the best parts of VScode." All the core and critical features of VScode exist in every other editor. LiveShare and Remote are, as far as I and the author can tell, not replicated by any other editor, and are therefore (subjectively) the "best parts". Whether or not you know anyone who uses the features is irrelevant.
  - edoceo 6y ago
    The person I was replying to used the words "critical" and "core". As to best (admittedly subjective) if they are so good I'd think that one of the 100s of devs I know depend on them. The only close one was Remote - which other editors do too - When I showed that remote drops code to the far end machine we determined that to be too risky - and went back to sshfs. Also, if those extension are so "best" why hasn't a replica been created? Or why didn't any other editor have them? It might be those extension are not so compelling. Also, my previous favorite editor (jEdit) had remote features back in like 2003 - maybe earlier.
    - codemonkey-zeta 6y ago
      I don't agree with the word choice of the parent, but I think the argument stands if you replace "critical" and "core" with "best". That's why I chose to re-reference the original article. I'm curious if you've used the live share features personally, and if you have if you've found value in them. I suspect many devs do not like collaborative programming in general, and so may never use them or like them if they have. As someone who thoroughly enjoys collaborative programming, I can tell you that these features are extremely compelling. It's way easier to tell your designer friend to boot up VScode and click on a link to your live app running locally than almost any other solution I've found. It also makes pair programming extremely easy. I used to use vim and now emacs for everything. I've also used JetBrains products for years. The only reason I ever boot up VScode is for those features. You just can't replicate the experience in any other editor as easily. Every other feature of VScode I've found a similar or better solution in every other editor. I'd be interested to hear any other feature of VScode that you think is as compelling, without parallel in any other editor. I suspect there are few/none.