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I'm a pretty casual vinyl listener (mostly got into it since I like having a physical representation of the music I love, and to reclaim some sense of ownership

I'm a pretty casual vinyl listener (mostly got into it since I like having a physical representation of the music I love, and to reclaim some sense of ownership in a world defined by Spotify and Apple Music). I enjoyed this post, and more or less agree with the author's opinion that claims of superior vinyl audio quality are bunk - and particularly meaningless in a world where most new music is recorded or produced digitally in the first place. That said, I probably still would avoid a cheapo player like this that does not have an adjustable tone arm. For one, it's more likely to have issues skipping when you can't adjust it properly. The second concern - which I'll admit I have no data to back up, and since this is an opinion from the audiophile community, may warrant some skepticism - is that cheap players with unbalanced tone arms are infamous for supposedly wearing down records more quickly over time by applying too much pressure. The author's note about the stereo output being unbalanced, by the way, is a relatively common side effect of an unbalanced tone arm (though there's various other reasons it can occur).

swimfar 6y ago
Even a lot of relatively cheap record players have adjutable tonearm weights. But it's not just the vertical needle force that wears out the records. The other issue is lack of adjustable (or any) anti-skate force. This keeps the needle from being forced to one side of the groove. I stumbled across the article recently where someone set up an A/B test to try to observe record damage from these cheap turntables. While there are some limitations of the experiment, I thought it was a good idea. There are too many "facts" that are just accepted as true without any emperical observation (not just in the audio community). https://www.audioappraisal.com/will-a-cheap-turntable-damage-your-records/ https://www.audioappraisal.com/will-a-cheap-turntable-damage...
- avolcano 6y ago
  Yeah, I didn't mean to imply you had to break the bank to avoid damaging your records. And good note on the anti-skate tracking as well!
techsupporter 6y ago
> I enjoyed this post, and more or less agree with the author's opinion that claims of superior vinyl audio quality are bunk - and particularly meaningless in a world where most new music is recorded or produced digitally in the first place. Exactly, at least for me as well. Perhaps older music, mastered in analog and later put out for radio airplay (or converted to digital) by slamming all of the levels as high as they'd go, sounds better on vinyl insofar as vinyl is as close to "original" as you're going to get. The "loudness war" is a thing, for sure. But for me, it's a hobby, and hobbies need not be completely efficient. I like fiddling with my mid-range record player, digging for albums I like, finding the one copy of a Broadway soundtrack of a wildly popular band's album that got made once and wasn't very popular[0], and just watching the record go round while I listen with decent headphones. And, especially, reading articles like this that take a lighthearted view of taking apart a piece of kit. 0 - "American Idiot, the Musical"
Someone1234 6y ago
There's two different arguments being conflated: - Vinyl is higher fidelity (yourself, and the article). - Vinyl sounds better. Vinyl colors sound, in the same way that some Vacuum Tubes color sound, which is a roundabout way of saying: They objectively make it less similar to the reference material than straight digital. But even though Vinyl is objectively worse at reproduction, some people prefer it (i.e. it subjectively sounds better to them). Why might that be? And that question itself is when you go down a rabbit hole (e.g. Does playing a Vinyl album twice ever sound identical? And is this imperfection more pleasurable to some people than a perfect one? Etc). I don't own any Vinyl nor am I a big Vinyl aficionado, but there's undeniably a colorization when listening to a song in Vinyl Vs. digital, and then we get into the subjective realm of if this is "better" or "worse." PS - This is true all across the audio reproduction realm. For example horn Vs. reference-style speakers, horns also heavily colorize and are quite popular (particularly for Home Theater), but are also divisive because it is objectively "worse" (but subjectively "better" for some).
- mtts 6y ago
  One other reason why vinyl sounds better is that how it’s mastered. For streaming, tracks are optimized for low quality headphones and phone speakers. Loudness is all that is required. Mastering for vinyl, however, takes effort. Do it wrong and the record becomes unplayable. So when you have to put in the effort anyway, might as well make it sound good at the same time. A/B some tracks some time. Chances are the vinyl version sounds more polished with a bit more dynamics instead of having everything slam into a limiter. This has nothing to do with sound coloring or “warmth”.
  - Baeocystin 6y ago
    To add on to above, the Wikipedia article on the Loudness War is an interesting read: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loudness_war https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loudness_war
    - tuatoru 6y ago
      Yeah, the Loudness War is why (new pressings from) old 1970s and 1980s masters sound better to many people. (Me included.) To add to the differences, technological limitations of vinyl (inability to handle heavy bass) possibly affected the music that was made and published. Maybe it had to be more melodic, or something.
edent 6y ago
As a newbie to vinyl, I had no idea about tone arms. Part of my intention with this was to replace all the guts with a Raspberry Pi and control things like the arm digitally. As for the wear on the vinyl - there are quite a few original pressings of Sgt Pepper. I don't mind scratching this one to hell and back!

swimfar 6y ago

Even a lot of relatively cheap record players have adjutable tonearm weights. But it's not just the vertical needle force that wears out the records. The other issue is lack of adjustable (or any) anti-skate force. This keeps the needle from being forced to one side of the groove. I stumbled across the article recently where someone set up an A/B test to try to observe record damage from these cheap turntables. While there are some limitations of the experiment, I thought it was a good idea. There are too many "facts" that are just accepted as true without any emperical observation (not just in the audio community). https://www.audioappraisal.com/will-a-cheap-turntable-damage-your-records/ https://www.audioappraisal.com/will-a-cheap-turntable-damage...

avolcano 6y ago
Yeah, I didn't mean to imply you had to break the bank to avoid damaging your records. And good note on the anti-skate tracking as well!

techsupporter 6y ago

> I enjoyed this post, and more or less agree with the author's opinion that claims of superior vinyl audio quality are bunk - and particularly meaningless in a world where most new music is recorded or produced digitally in the first place. Exactly, at least for me as well. Perhaps older music, mastered in analog and later put out for radio airplay (or converted to digital) by slamming all of the levels as high as they'd go, sounds better on vinyl insofar as vinyl is as close to "original" as you're going to get. The "loudness war" is a thing, for sure. But for me, it's a hobby, and hobbies need not be completely efficient. I like fiddling with my mid-range record player, digging for albums I like, finding the one copy of a Broadway soundtrack of a wildly popular band's album that got made once and wasn't very popular[0], and just watching the record go round while I listen with decent headphones. And, especially, reading articles like this that take a lighthearted view of taking apart a piece of kit. 0 - "American Idiot, the Musical"

Someone1234 6y ago

There's two different arguments being conflated: - Vinyl is higher fidelity (yourself, and the article). - Vinyl sounds better. Vinyl colors sound, in the same way that some Vacuum Tubes color sound, which is a roundabout way of saying: They objectively make it less similar to the reference material than straight digital. But even though Vinyl is objectively worse at reproduction, some people prefer it (i.e. it subjectively sounds better to them). Why might that be? And that question itself is when you go down a rabbit hole (e.g. Does playing a Vinyl album twice ever sound identical? And is this imperfection more pleasurable to some people than a perfect one? Etc). I don't own any Vinyl nor am I a big Vinyl aficionado, but there's undeniably a colorization when listening to a song in Vinyl Vs. digital, and then we get into the subjective realm of if this is "better" or "worse." PS - This is true all across the audio reproduction realm. For example horn Vs. reference-style speakers, horns also heavily colorize and are quite popular (particularly for Home Theater), but are also divisive because it is objectively "worse" (but subjectively "better" for some).

mtts 6y ago
One other reason why vinyl sounds better is that how it’s mastered. For streaming, tracks are optimized for low quality headphones and phone speakers. Loudness is all that is required. Mastering for vinyl, however, takes effort. Do it wrong and the record becomes unplayable. So when you have to put in the effort anyway, might as well make it sound good at the same time. A/B some tracks some time. Chances are the vinyl version sounds more polished with a bit more dynamics instead of having everything slam into a limiter. This has nothing to do with sound coloring or “warmth”.
- Baeocystin 6y ago
  To add on to above, the Wikipedia article on the Loudness War is an interesting read: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loudness_war https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loudness_war
  - tuatoru 6y ago
    Yeah, the Loudness War is why (new pressings from) old 1970s and 1980s masters sound better to many people. (Me included.) To add to the differences, technological limitations of vinyl (inability to handle heavy bass) possibly affected the music that was made and published. Maybe it had to be more melodic, or something.

edent 6y ago

As a newbie to vinyl, I had no idea about tone arms. Part of my intention with this was to replace all the guts with a Raspberry Pi and control things like the arm digitally. As for the wear on the vinyl - there are quite a few original pressings of Sgt Pepper. I don't mind scratching this one to hell and back!