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I'm attempting to offer you some insight in good faith. I can't offer you a mathematical proof of this so I'm not sure what you're looking for. If you insist on

I'm attempting to offer you some insight in good faith. I can't offer you a mathematical proof of this so I'm not sure what you're looking for. If you insist on asserting that Google Fellows are treated the same as other engineers then I'm not sure what to tell you. Holding that view would call into question exactly why they had that title but I'm not you and I don't hold that view.

akerl_ 6y ago
I’m asking for an anecdote or some other practical example of a time that you or another Google engineer had a policy or “stricture” applied to you, and that policy or stricture or procedure didn’t apply to a Fellow. I don’t expect there to be a mathematical proof, but I was curious for something that wasn’t conjecture about what people assume their work environment is like. Regarding being a Fellow: finding out that people respect senior engineers and take into consideration their past experience isn’t shocking, or an example of the rules not applying to them. Similarly, if you told me that a head chef at a restaurant has more impact on the menu than a line cook, it wouldn’t be an indication that the rules don’t apply to head chefs, or that nobody cares about their performance. And nobody would make claims that restaurant’s menu didn’t reflect their “ethos” because it was designed by an experienced head chef.
- googthrowaway42 6y ago
  It's been pointed out by someone who still has access to the internal org chart that they're not actually fellows so the point is kind of moot with respect to that. I assume they're distinguished engineers but I'm not sure. I actually do think that Go in its adoption by Google is a reflection of Google engineering values. I still don't think that someone who comes in to Google at the level that the Go creators came in would have the same experience as someone who came in entry level cut their teeth moving up through Google but that's just my perspective. A lot of people I met had only been at 1 or 2 other companies before Google (my TL had actually been at Google his whole professional life) and a lot of their opinions about engineering were shaped by how Google did things.

akerl_ 6y ago

I’m asking for an anecdote or some other practical example of a time that you or another Google engineer had a policy or “stricture” applied to you, and that policy or stricture or procedure didn’t apply to a Fellow. I don’t expect there to be a mathematical proof, but I was curious for something that wasn’t conjecture about what people assume their work environment is like. Regarding being a Fellow: finding out that people respect senior engineers and take into consideration their past experience isn’t shocking, or an example of the rules not applying to them. Similarly, if you told me that a head chef at a restaurant has more impact on the menu than a line cook, it wouldn’t be an indication that the rules don’t apply to head chefs, or that nobody cares about their performance. And nobody would make claims that restaurant’s menu didn’t reflect their “ethos” because it was designed by an experienced head chef.

googthrowaway42 6y ago
It's been pointed out by someone who still has access to the internal org chart that they're not actually fellows so the point is kind of moot with respect to that. I assume they're distinguished engineers but I'm not sure. I actually do think that Go in its adoption by Google is a reflection of Google engineering values. I still don't think that someone who comes in to Google at the level that the Go creators came in would have the same experience as someone who came in entry level cut their teeth moving up through Google but that's just my perspective. A lot of people I met had only been at 1 or 2 other companies before Google (my TL had actually been at Google his whole professional life) and a lot of their opinions about engineering were shaped by how Google did things.