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> I would completely shirk the academic duty of seeking understanding if there was an easier equivalent to get the same grade. This is rational behavior in mas

> I would completely shirk the academic duty of seeking understanding if there was an easier equivalent to get the same grade. This is rational behavior in mass education systems where grades are important for future success. It's an example of Goodhart's law in action, I suppose. It was only in my late 20s that I came to understand the true purpose of writing essays, and why essays are so frequently used as a form of assessment. All through my actual education I focused on maximizing my grades while minimizing the effort I expended. I've been meaning to write an essay on this subject for a while.

Jtsummers 6y ago
But grades aren't important for success, they're important for opportunity. The student with lower grades may lose out on some opportunities, or only get access to them later, but if they've gained better understanding (while a student) of the material, they'll be better off in the long run than the person acing every test and homework, primarily by cramming and forgetting in a week. Once you get a job, your grades barely matter anymore. And after several positions and a few years in the field, no one is likely to ask for your transcript.
- ecdavis 6y ago
  > But grades aren't important for success, they're important for opportunity. A fair distinction, yes. > The student with lower grades may lose out on some opportunities, or only get access to them later, but if they've gained better understanding (while a student) of the material, they'll be better off in the long run than the person acing every test and homework, primarily by cramming and forgetting in a week. I'd like to believe this, but I don't think it's true. Prestige, connections, and opportunity costs are too significant to ignore. > Once you get a job, your grades barely matter anymore. And after several positions and a few years in the field, no one is likely to ask for your transcript. True, but at a large enough company you'll participate in a performance review system in which you'll regularly be given a literal grade which influences your career trajectory. Goodhart's law comes into effect again.
  - unishark 6y ago
    Goodhart's law comes in because students who do not deserve good grades still can get them via other means besides than the professor intended. Hence grades become less trustworthy (they might lack understanding but "hacked" their way through via cramming etc). However understanding the material also leads to good grades. It's not like there's a trade-off there where students must choose one and thereby lose the other.
- babesh 6y ago
  It’s all about the opportunity. If you are competing with someone for a promotion, the easiest way to win is to deny them the opportunity to excel. Have seen this again and again. That is why there are always battles for projects.
- TeMPOraL 6y ago
  Opportunities are very often just thresholds you have to cross. Once you get a job, not only your grades barely matter anymore, but also most of your knowledge and experience. Companies are very bad at evaluating individual contribution, so it's much easier to stay in than to get in. Or, in picture form: imagining you start on the left of the graph and can move along the curve to the right, reality isn't like this: Skills required ^ ------- | / | -------/ |--------------------> Salary but rather, it's like this: Skills required ^ | /\ | -------/ \------ |--------------------> Salary And that little fence to cross is mostly looking at your grades, not actual understanding.

Jtsummers 6y ago

But grades aren't important for success, they're important for opportunity. The student with lower grades may lose out on some opportunities, or only get access to them later, but if they've gained better understanding (while a student) of the material, they'll be better off in the long run than the person acing every test and homework, primarily by cramming and forgetting in a week. Once you get a job, your grades barely matter anymore. And after several positions and a few years in the field, no one is likely to ask for your transcript.

ecdavis 6y ago
> But grades aren't important for success, they're important for opportunity. A fair distinction, yes. > The student with lower grades may lose out on some opportunities, or only get access to them later, but if they've gained better understanding (while a student) of the material, they'll be better off in the long run than the person acing every test and homework, primarily by cramming and forgetting in a week. I'd like to believe this, but I don't think it's true. Prestige, connections, and opportunity costs are too significant to ignore. > Once you get a job, your grades barely matter anymore. And after several positions and a few years in the field, no one is likely to ask for your transcript. True, but at a large enough company you'll participate in a performance review system in which you'll regularly be given a literal grade which influences your career trajectory. Goodhart's law comes into effect again.
- unishark 6y ago
  Goodhart's law comes in because students who do not deserve good grades still can get them via other means besides than the professor intended. Hence grades become less trustworthy (they might lack understanding but "hacked" their way through via cramming etc). However understanding the material also leads to good grades. It's not like there's a trade-off there where students must choose one and thereby lose the other.
babesh 6y ago
It’s all about the opportunity. If you are competing with someone for a promotion, the easiest way to win is to deny them the opportunity to excel. Have seen this again and again. That is why there are always battles for projects.
TeMPOraL 6y ago
Opportunities are very often just thresholds you have to cross. Once you get a job, not only your grades barely matter anymore, but also most of your knowledge and experience. Companies are very bad at evaluating individual contribution, so it's much easier to stay in than to get in. Or, in picture form: imagining you start on the left of the graph and can move along the curve to the right, reality isn't like this: Skills required ^ ------- | / | -------/ |--------------------> Salary but rather, it's like this: Skills required ^ | /\ | -------/ \------ |--------------------> Salary And that little fence to cross is mostly looking at your grades, not actual understanding.